Bioware Backlash

[Treyster]

I assume I'm not the only one fairly amused by the sudden reactions by fans towards a certain insignificant "RPG" studio.

http://www.destructoid.com/bioware-writer-s-vagina-versus-the-internet-222206.phtml

This particularly cements Interplay Prod/Black Isle's legacy evermore and how advanced the team was. Bioware was simply playing a copy cat game with Baldur's Gate.

And I'd like to think as Fallout fans are a more broadened, enlightened, possibly intellectual bunch we wouldn't backlash one of Wasteland, FO1, FO2, P:T, I, etc. writers simply if they didn't play video games. Even if we were blassed by the most top notch stuff in the entire history of C-RPGs. Much less go on a childish name calling vendetta.

Now we know while BGS wasn't ideal they at least smell of wasted potential no matter the project. Bioware would of shitted on FO completely more and forget about New Vegas. The studio never had any talent. All it took was a scapegoat in EA for their followers to start realizing.

Not that the TPSes in ME1/2 weren't amusing(And previous BW games). I'm just saying that it's hilarious Bioware was ever considered an elite RPG studio. Looking Glass crafted better Hybrid RPGs than their "100% Completely C-RPG Experience's."

I guess all false developers are to fall some day.

 

[Lexx]

Oh, the Bethesda hate was quite big some years ago. The thing is, such stuff mostly comes from a minority, which in return makes other people say / think that group-of-people-xy is all responsible for that and the other way around. I find it highly silly, but that's how the internet rolls. Pretty sure that a lot of these haters didn't even informed themself about the issues and just read the text on some random image, send from board to board.

 

[ZeusComplex]

The idea of a "skip combat" option is pretty absurd in my eyes. Then why make games? If she wants to write un-interactive content, then stick with books. Or movies.

For complete fairness, one person can't really ruin Bioware and they've been going downhill since after Neverwinter Nights. It's just people never noticed it because they where once a one platform, not mainstream company. I could even use the EA excuse. While this may be some of the issue, AAA publishers still make good games. Maybe not classic games like we got in droves back in the late 80's, early 90's, but I still enjoy the occasional title from the big fish.

Bioware's issue is that their games are becoming less of games and more of interactive movies. They just use the RPG moniker because that is what they became popular for. Orgins was a bit of a love letter to older RPGs because it's probably the only title after their D&D era to have RPG like gameplay. But anything else, ToR, ME, JE, DA2: they all sacrifice as much gameplay as possible to focus on the story. I don't care how good your story is. I play games to play games, not listen and watch a movie with some input.

Even BG was a bit un-interactive. The D&D rules and tactical combat was what kept those game interesting. No, I believe Bioware's crowing achievement was indeed Neverwinter Nights. It's the title with the most game, and contained a RPG multiplayer that far exceeds any MMO that is released and will be released until they give back the creative power to the player.

 

[gabahadatta]

The idea of a "skip combat" option is pretty absurd in my eyes. Then why make games?

Are you aware that not all games are shooters/slashers/combat games? And not all gamers are looking for combat in games?

FFS, you are on a Fallout fansite, a game that could be played more than fine without combat and with talking only.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Oh, the Bethesda hate was quite big some years ago. The thing is, such stuff mostly comes from a minority, which in return makes other people say / think that group-of-people-xy is all responsible for that and the other way around. I find it highly silly, but that's how the internet rolls. Pretty sure that a lot of these haters didn't even informed themself about the issues and just read the text on some random image, send from board to board.

Though it is not like people dont have a point. Biowhore IS on a decline here. Particularly when it comes to the quality of their content and the writting. I have no clue if that is because of that woman (which I doubt she is for sure not the only writter working for them not to mention she probably is not the lead artist or what ever the real decisions are made by others ).

I have to say what I enjoyed about Mass Effect 1 and 2 for example was the fact that NOT all characters would jump in to the bed with you (if I remember it correctly) and the sexual relationships have been a bit more subtle compared to Dragon Age which feelt pretty forced and artifical sometimes.

Baldurs Gate sure was not the most inteligent game when it comes to writting. But I think for an "epic" story it was much better then Dragon Age.

The idea of a "skip combat" option is pretty absurd in my eyes. Then why make games?

Are you aware that not all games are shooters/slashers/combat games? And not all gamers are looking for combat in games?

FFS, you are on a Fallout fansite, a game that could be played more than fine without combat and with talking only.

No obviously. Planescape Torment proves that SOME games can offer you a different experience.

But the point here is not that you have the option to skip combat but the fact that Bioware games indeed start to become interactive movies instead of gameplay.

Now the "story" is a tricky thing. When it comes to games. I mean I am sure we all enjoyed those board games in our youth because of the story. A good RPG obviously needs something like a story it is what gets you started in the game. But a game is a form of entertaiment with specific traits just as how books or movies and all have their own qualities. If people work with them they should always try to keep those in mind. I mean gameplay is at least as important like the story. With some games even more.

That is why some of the most known games dont even have a story to begin with. Counter Strike, Quake Arena, Unreal etc. to name a few. No real story or anything that is very complex. As said. There are exceptions (like in every other media be it movies or books) like Metal Gear Solid - But the gameplay is here usually very good as well!.

Many of the really great games are remembered more for the gameplay then the story. Take C&C for example. I mean even today some of the most succesfull games still dont have really a story. The Sims.

 

[Ohaimerk]

If a developer were any good he'd make a way to get through a combat area without actually using any combat. In a ROLE playing game you should be able to play any ROLE you chose, including the wimpy smooth-talking intelligent pacifist who couldn't hurt a fly if his life depended on it. Diplomacy and rounding up others to fight for your cause and all that. Fallout 2's end boss, for example. You can recruit the dudes to the east and activate the turrets and beat him without lifting a finger yourself. Things like that are much better than a "skip combat button". But, you know, takes effort and skill on the developer's part and all that

 

[Crni Vuk]

yes I know where you are coming from. Even though Fallout 2 is a bad example because you actually dont avoid combat. You just use other skills to solve the "fight". It still happens. The result is the same.

I think Fallout 1 with the master for example was a great example. The combat or fight could be more or less avoided. You convinced the enemy in a very logical and believable way. A "talk" option like shown sometimes in recent Bio-Games feels rather forced then natural. I know those games are not about realism. But that does not mean the writting has not to be "believable". As you correctly explain. It should take some "effort" so that it feels like you accomplished something rare or special here. Diplomacy isnt easy in real life either so I would not expect it to be easy in a game either.

 

[Guiltyofbeingtrite]

Mass Effect is much a less a role playing game than the Fallouts, you're a soldier and by definition they fight, so while some battles should be avoidable not all of them.

As for a skip combat button? Sounds fine in theory except that the more popular it gets the more focus will be on cinematics and less on gameplay. Which severely hurt games like MGS4, if you ask me.

As for the beating up this writer, meh. Don't admit you don't play games in an open forum. That's like an Apple PR guy saying they don't care about smartphones, stupid. That doesn't justify the ganging up though.

 

[ZeusComplex]

Are you aware that not all games are shooters/slashers/combat games? And not all gamers are looking for combat in games?

FFS, you are on a Fallout fansite, a game that could be played more than fine without combat and with talking only.

You pretty much said it right there, "The option to play the game without resorting to violence."

If you have a game where combat is 50% of the experience, then why add a "skip" button? I'm even against the idea of skipping cutscenes, unless they are implemented before the chance to save (aka Final Fantasy, Metal Gear Solid.) right when you're about to enter a fight. In that case, any attempts to skip after the first viewing, is ok. If you don't want combat to be a focus, then just think of creative ways to skip it such as diplomacy or intimidation (aka Fallout, Arcanum)

 

[Ilosar]

If you have a game where combat is 50% of the experience, then why add a "skip" button?

Same reason you can push Space or Esc to skip a conversation. Even in the older Fallouts. That's what the defenders of the option say, at any rate. I kinda agree, but gameplay is not the same as skipping cutscenes.

That said, the hate for Hepler (and Gaider, to a lesser extent) is just pathetic. I once read a Let's Play of DA2 on Something Awful that was basically a huge hating thead on her, even on characters she didn't even fucking write. As an avowed Bioware enthusiast, I can say that their writing has gone downhill. But all these keyboard warriors can go to hell, and I don't give a damn that the Bioware team retorted to these assholes. They deserve every bit of venom coming their way.

 

[rcorporon]

I wish Uncharted had a "skip combat" button.

As for Bioware, I haven't really enjoyed one of their games in a long while (ME1 was decent) but the quality of their writing has gone down a lot.

 

[WelcomeToNewReno]

Heh heh. That guy acted like he's in grade school.

Your friend is an obese, moronic cunt!

Fuck you!

Wha.. What!?! That's not nice! You hurt my feelings! I'm telliiiinnnng!

 

[fedaykin]

As someone who thought ME1 was mediocre and deleted DA1 after 30 minutes, I find it amusing that people took this long to notice things. I guess all the kids grew up or something. People are not exactly loving SWTOR either. One can only hope that the end of Bioware is nigh. It's time for a new player to emerge.
I did kinda enjoy NWN1, though, but never completed it.

 

[Autoduel76]

Obviously venom spewed by the internet masses is over the top and out of line. But it' 2012 and this should be accepted now as much as gravity.

The "article" was pretty poorly written and poorly thought out and Hepler made some pretty classic, foreseeable and obvious mistakes.

The "your jealous of my job and my vagina", the "I don't play games"...how net-naive can you be?

I'd also say that the premise that a writer for video games isn't hampered by not playing games isn't all that solid of a premise to begin with. The writer of the article glosses over it as if it's just obvious but fails to defend that premise.

I suppose I could see a scenario where a lead designer has such a strong vision, has a very strong grasp of the writing process and needs, and is able to outline and manage the project so perfectly that all he needs copy written.

But that's not how things work in reality, is it? And it seems an awful lot like asking someone who doesn't watch movies to write a script.

All in all, its a sad look at the immaturity of the game industry. The immaturity of internet users is a known issue.

 

[Kilus]

I'd also say that the premise that a writer for video games isn't hampered by not playing games isn't all that solid of a premise to begin with. The writer of the article glosses over it as if it's just obvious but fails to defend that premise.

It is a solid premise and justifies the jealous comment. No one needs to play games to write, make sound or artwork for games. It's a total non factor. They aren't hired for their ability to play games but to make components of a game. If they can write how the company needs then that's all what needs to happen.

But that's not how things work in reality, is it? And it seems an awful lot like asking someone who doesn't watch movies to write a script.

Happens all the time. Movie watching does not equal script writing.

Also in the real world Bioware is doing fantastic.

 

[Brother None]

Jim Sterling is basically a troll paid as a professional. Even within the industry of game journalism, he's not well-respected.

 

[TheWesDude]

if she doesnt play computer games then she cannot understand the context in which it will be consumed.

allow me to provide an example of one of my friends who went to college and took an art class.

he slaved over his computer making a piece of work for display for an art show. he spent at least 100 hours or so working on it and it was a really good piece. after he finished he took it and put it up on his wall until they needed it for the show. we all agreed it was really awesome.

when they took his piece and put it up, they put it up on a dark background because they felt it mirrored the piece well as it was primarily dark. problem was he designed it to work best on a white background/backdrop and on the dark background they put it it lost a bit of impact.

had he known that is what they were going to do, he would have added a 2-3 inch white border around it to emphasize the contrast and darkness inherent in the work.

if you do not understand or know the context or backdrop of how a work is designed to be consumed, then the impact it has may not be the intended effect.

if she hasnt played very many computer games, then she wont have experience or understanding of how others have done it and what worked and what didnt.

because she doesnt understand the context. all she knows is how her work looks and feels in the vacuum of where/how she writes and/or imagines it will be consumed, not how it actually will be consumed.

there are many more examples of why this is a bad thing. but it does not speak to her, it speaks to bioware and their hiriing practices that they would hire someone to do a job without understanding the medium.

 

[Ben]

All that talk about video games and vaginas, can I get her number?

 

[Crni Vuk]

...

Exactly. This is what they teach us in art classes. You have to learn the rules before you can brake them.

It is not important if you like it. But you have to understand it.

In games just like in any other media there have been standarts which have been used for years. Not because of some arbitrary reason. But because they have proven them self to be good. Today many companies move away from it because it is easier to simply throw interactive movies toward their audience.

It is a solid premise and justifies the jealous comment. No one needs to play games to write, make sound or artwork for games. It's a total non factor. They aren't hired for their ability to play games but to make components of a game. If they can write how the company needs then that's all what needs to happen.

If you ask me it is somewhat important to at least know the medium you write for. Obviously you dont have to love it. But you have to appreciante it.

Besides. I dont think this woman is capable of writting good game plots. But well. It seems many things in Bioware changed over the time for the worse when it comes to that.

 

[Makagulfazel]

All that talk about video games and vaginas, can I get her number?

She might let you skip the foreplay.