I think i figured out how to make armor penetration finally!

D

Dubby

Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?
First of all, a few things:

1) *All* actors have 71 actor values (AV). Only 60 of them are in use, and 10 of them are blank.
2) More Resistances -can- be created using some of the blank AV's

Here's how the system would work:

1) -All- armor will have zero DR.
2) -All- weapons will have only one point of DAM.
3) -All- armor will have an enchantment that factors in various resistances (SR [soft], HR [hard], FR [fire], PR [plasma], ER [electric], LR [laser], XR [explosion] ). This will be visible underneath the item's description in the pipboy, where extra effects are listed.
4) All armors will list the two primary armor resists: SR and HR, and if applicable, list other armor resists
5) -All- weapons will deal damage via a weapon-based enchantment. Damage would be dealt instantly in most cases, and all weapons will list the two primary damage amounts: Soft & Hard, and like above, other types when applicable.

This system might lack the thresholds, but it -would- emulate the difference between shooting a dude with metal armor with a 10mm pistol in the chest, versus shooting a dude with metal armor with a .308 sniper round in the chest...

Opinions?

If you guys and gals are interested in this, I *WOULD* like helpers and assistants for this sub-project.
 
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mrowa said:
What about diffrent ammo types for one weapon is this passible ?
Click to expand...

One step at a time please;)

I agree with the idea. I don't have a good knowledge about modding but I'm willing to help.

I was thinking of scripting it but that would probably be a lot more complex and cpu intensive.

Do you have a know of how the system works now? Can you describe it here? I was under the assumption that DR doesn't affect radiation, poison and maybe other damage types.

Also i think we could have non zero DR to simulate a resistance to most damage types and add as effect the remainder (just a thought).

by explosion you mean the blast? Because if you mean the shrapnel it is covered with the other DR enchantments.

Tell me if you are interested in my help.
 
technically, it hink ammo types could be done with the SR and HR types.

say normal ammo being SR while FMJ or other armor piercing being HR
 
Actually... here is an example:

NOTE: (this is a bit confusing, but SR damage will rely on HR resist, and HR damage will rely on SR resist. that's so they act like penetration.)

A) Leather Armor ( SR+50, HR+5, FR-40, PR-60, ER+40, LR+10, XR+10 )
B) Metal Armor ( SR+15, HR+60, FR+30, PR+10, ER-60, LR+30, XR+10 )
C) JHP Pistol ( SD=35, HD=5 )
D) FMJ Pistol ( SD=10, HD=30 )

C vs A = 35.75
C vs B = 18.25
D vs A = 24.5
D vs B = 29.5


There's a very particular reason why guns can't use multiple ammo types right now, atleast not that i've figured out. It might be possible, somewhere in the future, but I don't know if it will be.
 
Maybe u can use Rock-It-All or whatever this luncher name is in eng version :P
It lunch multiply ammo types
 
The problem I see with the different ammo types:

The guns get automatically reloaded. Put the gun in the inventar and take it back in the hand - it is reloaded. Every weapon takes his own ammo if you have it in the inventory and activate the weapon. So - imo - first there is a need for a) a function with that the ammo is saved in the gun, even if you put it away into the inventory and b) at least a function with that you can change the ammo type if you have the weapon in the hands.
 
You forget it also has to be usable by NPCs, and before you ask, -no- the Junk Loader does not work with NPCs.

And that really wasn't meant as an example with different ammo on the same gun. More like :

C) 10mm Pistol ( SD=35, HD=5 )
D) Hunting Rifle ( SD=10, HD=30 )
 
Dubby, if you need some sort of scalable system with numbers, I'll help you out. Unfortunately I can do the numbers only as I have no clue on how to mod. PM me if you need help.
 
Sicblades said:
Dubby, if you need some sort of scalable system with numbers, I'll help you out. Unfortunately I can do the numbers only as I have no clue on how to mod. PM me if you need help.
Click to expand...

Ah, alright then. Damage dealt by enchantments already calculate their designated resistance AV, but they also ignore the primary resistance, DR. And unlike DR, these enchantment resists can go over 100... or below -100.

Think you could setup something to show a graph of armor vs. weapon entries, where the line is the total damage actually dealt? I'd -really- like that. Lol.
 
Dubby said:
You forget it also has to be usable by NPCs, and before you ask, -no- the Junk Loader does not work with NPCs.

And that really wasn't meant as an example with different ammo on the same gun. More like :

C) 10mm Pistol ( SD=35, HD=5 )
D) Hunting Rifle ( SD=10, HD=30 )
Click to expand...

So maybe weapons models taking for example 10mm pistol so he have few variants u go in to pipboy select 10mm pistol JHP press one of the mode button( HE option) in destription or somewhere near pistol image and your JHP pistol disapire from your inv but u get HE pistol which use he ammo
 
mrowa said:
Dubby said:
You forget it also has to be usable by NPCs, and before you ask, -no- the Junk Loader does not work with NPCs.

And that really wasn't meant as an example with different ammo on the same gun. More like :

C) 10mm Pistol ( SD=35, HD=5 )
D) Hunting Rifle ( SD=10, HD=30 )
Click to expand...

So maybe weapons models taking for example 10mm pistol so he have few variants u go in to pipboy select 10mm pistol JHP press one of the mode button( HE option) in destription or somewhere near pistol image and your JHP pistol disapire from your inv but u get HE pistol which use he ammo
Click to expand...

If someone can figure out how to add a new to button the weapons panel in the pipboy GUI and set it up to run a script when clicked, then I can write up weapons with multiple ammo types easily. It would take a couple days to build it though, but it would be a very straight-forward project. Plus, it wouldn't matter whether or not NPCs could differentiate ammos for a weapon, all their loot is pre-handled from spawning lists anyways.
 
Dubby said:
Sicblades said:
Dubby, if you need some sort of scalable system with numbers, I'll help you out. Unfortunately I can do the numbers only as I have no clue on how to mod. PM me if you need help.
Click to expand...

Ah, alright then. Damage dealt by enchantments already calculate their designated resistance AV, but they also ignore the primary resistance, DR. And unlike DR, these enchantment resists can go over 100... or below -100.

Think you could setup something to show a graph of armor vs. weapon entries, where the line is the total damage actually dealt? I'd -really- like that. Lol.
Click to expand...

Yup, I can do something like that.

You said the Max DR was 71?
 
actually max DR is 85. but that number is -not- used when dealing with enchantments... so for all intensive purposes, any calculation can just leave that number out.
 
Yeah I re-read the OP better. I can do this, fairly easily. I'll have something for you tomorrow and we can tweak it to have it more balanced.
 
As an added bonus, I just discovered two extra resists that were previously unknown. Electric resist, and Frost resist.
 
Dubby said:
actually max DR is 85. but that number is -not- used when dealing with enchantments... so for all intensive purposes, any calculation can just leave that number out.
Click to expand...

Max DR is a gsmt value. I remember seeing it in fomm (90% sure).
There is also another gsmt value that deals with damage to resistance ratio.
 
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