common real world weapons

C

Chaoticlandraider^

First time out of the vault
After playing the proper fallouts about a million times then playing tactics once or twice i have to say the following.The war was around 2075 or something would weapons like m16's ak47's etc etc still be in broad use? the answear of course is most likely not i hope in fallout3 there will be far more orginal weapons or the amount of realworld weapons cut down alot.
 
Real-life weapons were there because hundreds of so-called "fans" asked for them on Interplay's message board. Which just proves that when you give power to the mass all they ever ask for is bread and circus.
 
The original Fallout's weapons were well-planned and balanced. Fallout Two, however, messed up this defined system with the inclusion of "real-world" weapons. In this case, more of something is not a good thing. Often times, in Fallout Two, you'll find an "uber" weapon in one of the categories that makes the rest of the weapons obsolete or a pair of weapons with such similiar characteristics that you'll overlook it.

And besides, by the time of 2075, America's Armalite series will have been replaced with the OICW, plus many more bull-pup varients for other nations. So time isn't really factored in correctly (In Fallout Two, there were still grease guns from World War Two still around).
 
I always thought that the reason for the real-life weapons (that were a bit older, like say 20th century and such) was that, just like the rest of the civilization, had been thrusted back a bit in time due to the nuke war...wasteland and such.
 
Yeah, but thinking on that merit, why would they include the H&K G11 rifle or the p90? Those weapons served the role of auxiliary weapons, more as side arms for tank crews and the like. In my opinion, they were added so they would keep in line with the trendy and nifty first-person gear.

Course, there are still weapons that show a "backward into time" effect due to the nukes. The FN FAL, for instance, is acceptable because it was adopted by many nations for their military. The generic weapons such as the "hunting rifle" or even handguns, whether they be 14mm or 10mm or whatever, because they are something you'd find in any backwater gunshop (since the 70's there have been enough handguns to arm every man, woman, and child in the world).

Basically, if you want the "thrust backward into time" effect, you'd have to find weapons that are either main stream or easy to find. Mainstream would be either weapons adopted and largely produced by a military, such as the Kalashnikov rifle which has been converted into so many forms, or weapons stockpiled due to war, such as World War Two's bolt-action rifles. The German GSG-9 still sometimes use their Mausers and the Garands are still made to fulfill hunting purposes. Easy to find weapons would be hunting shotguns or revolvers that can be bought at hunting or personal defense establishments.
 
I agree. Though, more interesting weapons beat realism in the weapons availiable. In the year 2075 which is some time from now, there would be no reason to use ye olde M16, as they would be ancient history much like the WWII bolt action rifles are now. Laser technology as displayed in the game may very well be real, as we are nearing our period of 'microtechnology'. The weapons now get so repetetive that it annoys me, not to mention taking up valuable space in my inverntory when I stock up after killing a whole bunch of people.
 
Gophermaster said:
I agree. Though, more interesting weapons beat realism in the weapons availiable. In the year 2075 which is some time from now, there would be no reason to use ye olde M16, as they would be ancient history much like the WWII bolt action rifles are now. Laser technology as displayed in the game may very well be real, as we are nearing our period of 'microtechnology'. The weapons now get so repetetive that it annoys me, not to mention taking up valuable space in my inverntory when I stock up after killing a whole bunch of people.
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if i am at wrong, the AK 114 / AK 112 were phased out to second line units, when all the front line units were equipped with energy weapons before the Great War.

so while energy weps were staple to the military backthen, the civvies still can only have access to those really old weapons. Also certain weapons like the Sten smg in FOT, are really goddamn easy to make.

remember in FO and FOT, the world has gone to hell. Gone are the vast amounts of fusion batteries and power armour that swept through China before the Great War. Most people only have themselves and if they are lucky, a handgun. It has being argued in DAC forums that energy weps were mass produced and GI friendly but then even there are energy weps in the millions, ammo in terms of fusion cells are insanely hard to get in the wasteland.

so its likely the civvies/tribals picked up the weapons of old and try to survive.
 
Like a big hammer?

Anyways, I see what you mean. But the crappy guns will just stockpile in your inverntory, while you are only using a few decent ones. Having lots of different types of handguns may improve the realism of the game. But it will quickly get boring, the few handguns that you can get in FO2 are more then enough, so they need to create new and great weapons and throw in a few 'common' ones. Hopefully not focus mainly on the 'common' weaponry.
 
As long as there isn't more "Energy" weapons they there are basic firearms, I will be happy. The more weapons the better IMHO.

Mohrg :twisted:
 
I like the real world weapons..I think that it would be a serious drawback if the game had only some futuristic made up weapons. I think it would make the game too futuristic and unreal...it is silly to think that every poor man and woman in the wasteland has an energy weapon or some brand new high tech weapon.
It is more likely that prewar weapons would be spread across the wastes due to the fact that there is so much of these weapons around already.
Even though there were alot of powerful weapons around after the war..these weapons would belong to the most powerful factions or groups..not some guy who sells pork in some hillybilly town in the wasteland.
The basic design of a weapon..for an example the desert eagle...will not change very much in the next 70 years. A plain gun is a very simple mechanism.
What im also trying to say is:
It felt so cool to have a desert eagle .50 or brass knuckles..even though they were'nt that powerful. But it's ok to use them early on. It's all about the feeling :) I just hope that they put enough of weapons in the game..along with a little history about them;)
I mean if you don't want to use the real world weapons then just dont!
 
Yeah, I liked that too, but the only problem was that, they sucked. Once you got your hands on a decent weapon you aren't inclined to use the old ones anymore. They should make it so that you can't really get any better guns really quickly because it ruins the fun. Not that the energy weapons make much difference as all it pretty much is, is a different name for the gun that runs on different ammo. But I was pretty much forced to use the Big/Energy weapons when I was nearing the end of the game, as it was too difficult to complete the game with my 10mm Pistol. (Which would be rather common)
 
Gaui said:
The basic design of a weapon..for an example the desert eagle...will not change very much in the next 70 years. A plain gun is a very simple mechanism.
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Desert Eagle is far from being a plain gun. Not every autoloading pistol out there can fire rimmed cartridges.

It's all about the feeling
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So basically you're all for the "kool factor" and don't give a shit about integrity of the world design.
 
Well okay..maybe the desert eagle was an bad example for a very plain gun..it's a very powerful pistol. But the design will probably be pretty much the same 70 years from now. But what do I know anyway;)

Well actually I do give a shit about the integrity of the game world.
This is just my opinion on things and it's just as good as yours.

I just think that if there were few real world weapons or just none at all...the game would'nt have a very realistic post nuclear war game-world.
 
Didn't we have this conversation already?

Here the thing. It's not the inclusion of real world guns that matter, it's consistency with the story. One make up weapons and as long as they are quality product, the audience will be happy.

Consistency with the story means that its a war in 2075 or so but built on a 1950s pulp image of what 2075 would be like. Then you take a big ass war that destroys the planet and people using what they have left or can find.

So today's real world weapons doesn't kick it. Many of the contemporary designs were not even imagined in the 1950s while some of the old designs were considered to be state-of-the-art.

Where a plasma or a laser weapon might be imagined, some of the more slick submachineguns in Fallout 2 shouldn't.

Then we have a second problem. Remember Fallout 1 is an early generation and Fallout 2 is 80 years later. A lot of the more complex and high maintenance weapons should be out just by wear and tear.

And even if they weren't out, who would remember their names? You have to think the average gun catalogue doesn't exist anymore, most people probably find the weapon on the body of some poor schmuck who got whacked, and then there is the fact that most people don't even read.

I say get rid of most of the named real weapons and stick with generics.

And I agree with the first post. This is all about trying to make sales to the consumers and not about good craftsmanship.
 
This is all about trying to make sales to the consumers and not about good craftsmanship.
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I can't see why those two things won't go hand in hand, if you have good craftmanship, sales will automatically improve. Bah.....

About the weapons: I don't think that it matters much whether the weapons are real world, as long as they fit in the whole atmosphere of the game. Somehow, I found that that experimental machine gun(high-tech looking) in both FO2 and Tactics didn't fit in. That went for a lot of weapons. More weapons doesn't necessaily make for a better game, and certainly not in the case of a Fallout game.....
Whatever they do with the weapons, it should FIT, not just be in there because some Chuckie-wannabe thought it'd be cool to have it in there.

(Btw: Why the hell is there a plasma-saw in POS???? Wasn't the ripper good enough or something???)
 
I kind of like the idea BIS is going with right now though. That is, the firearm would be called just "Assault Rifle."

HOWEVER, what I like, is having the item look exactly like an AK-47 or an M-16. The AK-47 could be called the generic "Assault Rifle" and the M-16 could be the "Vault City Assault Rifle." That way, you have your realism, but if you don't know about the guns in real life, it still maintains it's pulp 50's-style motiff. Maybe have a few firearms still have their standard names--like the Desert Eagle (but it's .45 calibre, not .50).

Besides, with a thousand types of pistols and rifles alone, it would be hard to catalog each and every one, and then somehow make them all unique within the game. This way, some of the more prominent ones will get some recognition without turning it into an NRA meeting.
 
Gaui said:
I like the real world weapons..I think that it would be a serious drawback if the game had only some futuristic made up weapons. I think it would make the game too futuristic and unreal...it is silly to think that every poor man and woman in the wasteland has an energy weapon or some brand new high tech weapon.
It is more likely that prewar weapons would be spread across the wastes due to the fact that there is so much of these weapons around already.
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Fallout does not take place in our future. Repeat that as many times as needed until it sinks in.

Notice the fact that the Great War was finalized by bombers with nuclear bomb payloads, not ICBMs like we have today. It took two hours for the bombers to start dropping their bombs until the world was wiped clean. ICBMs wouldn't even take 15 minutes to do the job, 30 minute travel time, 15 minute detection and launch time. By the time our ICBMs hit them, their ICBMs have been in the air for 15 minutes. That's our technology, which is better than theirs!

Notice the fact Fallout's computers are the size of clothes washing machines. Meanwhile, our computers can fit in your pocket. Did you totally miss that in all the computers shown in Fallout? Even Fallout's PipBoy 2000 series "PDA" had a CRT, and it was monochrome at that. All it did was store and retrieve information. Our PocketPCs, which are smaller and use LCDs, can execute millions of math and logic instructions in a single second.

Our technology is based on the IC and the transistor, something obviously not readily available in Fallout as you can see by all the vacuum tubes floating around on all the circuit boards. In fact, the water purification "chip" is a breadboard with gobs of tubes.

So, do you honestly think they'd have the same guns in that setting?!
 
Saint_Proverbius said:
Gaui said:
I like the real world weapons..I think that it would be a serious drawback if the game had only some futuristic made up weapons. I think it would make the game too futuristic and unreal...it is silly to think that every poor man and woman in the wasteland has an energy weapon or some brand new high tech weapon.
It is more likely that prewar weapons would be spread across the wastes due to the fact that there is so much of these weapons around already.
Click to expand...

Fallout does not take place in our future. Repeat that as many times as needed until it sinks in.

Notice the fact that the Great War was finalized by bombers with nuclear bomb payloads, not ICBMs like we have today. It took two hours for the bombers to start dropping their bombs until the world was wiped clean. ICBMs wouldn't even take 15 minutes to do the job, 30 minute travel time, 15 minute detection and launch time. By the time our ICBMs hit them, their ICBMs have been in the air for 15 minutes. That's our technology, which is better than theirs!

Notice the fact Fallout's computers are the size of clothes washing machines. Meanwhile, our computers can fit in your pocket. Did you totally miss that in all the computers shown in Fallout? Even Fallout's PipBoy 2000 series "PDA" had a CRT, and it was monochrome at that. All it did was store and retrieve information. Our PocketPCs, which are smaller and use LCDs, can execute millions of math and logic instructions in a single second.

Our technology is based on the IC and the transistor, something obviously not readily available in Fallout as you can see by all the vacuum tubes floating around on all the circuit boards. In fact, the water purification "chip" is a breadboard with gobs of tubes.

So, do you honestly think they'd have the same guns in that setting?!
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of course, we agree with taht, but for the sake of fun, it would be nice to have some real world weapons really.

why ?

Coz I love the Colt .45 in FoT.

:wink:
 
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