Could Synths have worked in the Fallout setting?

The Dutch Ghost

Grouchy old man of NMA
Moderator
Fallout technological issues and limitations aside, could synthetics have worked in the Fallout setting if the writing behind them had been better? (it could always have been made up that they originate from the one place were transistors and microchip processors were developed)
I am always open for new additional 'species' to the Fallout setting such as the Ghouls, Super Mutants, Ghost People (kind of Ghouls), the planned Troglodytes (not the ones from The Pitt), the Beastlords (I actually kind of like them), and more in such spirit. (I am not sure if we really can mentioned Psykers in this category as they are really really rare and it is not a mutation you can randomly pick up and I am not sure how many people inherited it)
So in that context I would have been willing to give Synths a chance.

Still I am not sure how far they should have gone at becoming like humans such as the Synth 3s. I would rather have made them a unique 'species' of their own that only emulates humanity to a certain degree but for the rest are more like walking computers.
Sort of like if Lt-Cmdr Data from Star Trek TNG decided to create a society like him.
 
They could definitely have worked.
A ZAX computer at a robot manufacturing plant wants to improve the robots so it keeps improving and improving and eventually it starts to wade into the territory of creating humans as it misses them and because it is a super computer with an AI that is actively trying to better itself and its counterparts it would make perfect sense. Eventually, over time, synths become a thing, the older robots become obsolete and become more of worker drones, slaves. Every new generation of synths is improved, more human looking, better mechanical functions, sounds more human, moves more human. A class system is slowly formed between the various gens of synths. All synths would come programmed to 'be' like humans, to replicate them as much as possible from whatever data ZAX had, so the synths aren't interested in the typical fearmongering about AI that it wants to self-improve and better itself. These synths are created by an AI that understands the needs for limitations and so imposes it upon them in their deep programming. Like instinctual behaviour. The robots it first created would be the ones that are sent out to collect whatever material can be used for manufacturing more synths and updating the manufacturing plant as well as ZAX itself.

Lots of interesting stuff could've been done with synths. Lots of ways for synths to make perfect sense too. I don't really have a problem with synths. It's the extremely advanced technology they use for synths in FO4 to the point that they are indistinguishable from humans (inside and out) that goes way too far. And for it to be made by a society that shut themselves in with limited resources just doesn't make much sense to me.

So yes, I think they could've worked.
 
Everything could worked as long there are some good writers handle it.
Well... Remember Killer Klowns From Outer Space? No matter the writing they simply would not fit in Fallout.
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Well... Remember Killer Klowns From Outer Space? No matter the writing they simply would not fit in Fallout.
killer-klowns-from-outer-space-di-jpg.3292
They made a great sequel to Wasteland 1 involving Killer Clowns from Outer Space.. It was successfully written and is still a well-remembered and well-regarded game today.
 
Wait, what?
Have you never played that abomination of a game?

Basically, EA Games wanted to make a sequel to Wasteland, so they made a game called Fountain of Dreams

The whole plot is about a group of mutant Clowns trying to take over Miami. At one point you find a friendly Witch Doctor who helps you infiltrate the "Killer Clown College" where you find out why the Killer Clowns are so violent. The Plot and Gameplay is just so shitty, that no game since has been able to top it.
 
I'll be covering Fallout 4 in my next reconstructing series, but my notes for the Institute are basically this so far:

Raiders: A reason for there being so many. Let's say it's two-fold. First, there's an old pre-war cloning lab that was part of an experiment to create a unified, homogenous fighting force of absolutely loyal, fearless soldiers. Basically a cannon-fodder initiative, but using troops who wouldn't break, would fight to the death, and who could be grown fast. Maybe they have a drastically reduced lifespan (think Bladerunner Replicants) because of the speed at which they're grown. Basically a cross between simulants and Anubis' Kull Warriors (two nice pop culture references there).

This would tie to the Institute. Basically, rather than calling themselves mankind's saviours and all that bollocks, we'll say this was the facility tasked with creating their new super soldiers. They didn't make it in time for the war, so the facility went dark, but didn't stop the experiments. We could say it was run by a ZAX mainframe AI, and over time it realised the soldiers weren't likely to work.

Understanding that humans are frail, it went down the route of creating clone cyborgs, enhancing the frail humans with cybernetic augments, both to extend their lifespan and to make them more durable. Additionally, with brain implants the new cyborgs could be directly controlled, unlike the original human clone experiments.

Alternatively, we could say the whole idea was cyborgs from the start, and the clones were basically just the initial phase, they never got to the cyborg phase because the war happened first. That way we can say the Vault 87 clones were the older, original experiment in cloning super soldiers and wasn't actually all that successful, and the Institute clones were a followup intended to merge clones with cybernetics.

(Note, this idea can tie also to Vault 106 was it? The Gary Vault anyway. Plus, it could also tie to 87 and the super soldier experiments there, say that was a secondary, private concern, also attempting to solve the problem, maybe via alternate means).

Anyway, this leads us to the idea that the insane numbers of raiders in the wastes are the result of the ZAX AI continuing to run its experiments attempting to find the perfect combination of organic and synthetic components, releasing them into the wild in order to test viability, survivability, etc.

The soldiers are unstable, thrive in combat situations, are belligerant and unwilling to cooperate, but seem basically ok in groups among themselves. Basically raiders. We can say the cloning technology isn't yet mature (even after this long) because Motherframe can't seem to figure out the problem, hence why the clones are so unstable. Or Motherframe just hasn't bothered figuring it out yet as she's too busy messing with perfecting the combat side of things for now.

One of the positive outcomes of this could be the player convincing Motherframe to stand down and stop the experiments. But as a side effect, we could also have a morally dubious 'positive' ending where she agrees to continue manufacturing clones to use as spare parts for medical needs. This would provide medical research, parts, spare organs, all sorts, giving the Commonwealth a massive boost to overall health of its people, longevity, etc.

We can also have themes of transhumanism coming in here. Some people will be absolutely against the idea of augmenting (heading into Deus Ex territory now...), some will welcome it. Kellogg could still be a thing, giving the player their first introduction to an enhanced human (maybe not as an enemy initially, but show Kellogg going toe-to-toe with someone in power armour or something and coming out on top to show the potential power of cybernetics).

This also gives us an offshoot of genetic research into stuff like FEV. If you really MUST have some sort of enemy like super mutants, this gives a reason for their existence beyond 'lol we felt like it'. We can say the ZAX (Motherframe? Could work with something like that) experimented with a strain of the Pan-Immunity project's virus/protection/whatever to create a sturdier frame for the cyborgs, but came to the conclusion that this wouldn't actually work well beyond certain specialised needs, because the mutants were simply too big. They could work as heavy weapon platforms, but for regular soldiers or covert ops and the like, nope.

Hell, could say this is what Vault 87's gig was, developing a larger model of clone with the express intention of creating heavy weapon drones and the like. Basically another alternative, or possibly even a compliment to, power armour.

Also, if we really must have 28 days-style zombie runners, we can say these are an offshoot of the research done into the above clones. Basically large quantities of rejects, ejected into the wastes to make room (and to provide potential additional data to the Motherframe, everything helps). That also avoids the issue of utterly breaking the established lore.

We can have human types with camo skin (literally! A chameleon type natural camo dealie), hybrid types that are like Centaurs (abominations created from several creatures), suiciders (not like the FO4 ones) who are human on the surface but have some sort of biological bomb ticking away inside them (like that episode of SG-1 that introduces Cass, this'd be a nice sudden event for Diamond City rather than the silly scene where you can't talk them down or otherwise do anything meaningful). Some sort of messed up Spiderman type experiment that can attach itself to walls, ambush from above, leap tall buildings, maybe even slow the player with sticky weblike material, place traps, and so on. Lots of ideas can be applied to humans and humanlike enemies for variety, rather than... Raider, Slighty less crap Raider, Raider in power armour, Raider on drugs... *sigh*

So yeah... similar themes, transhumanism, augmentation, ethical medical dilemmas, all sorts would be possible.
 
Have you never played that abomination of a game?

Basically, EA Games wanted to make a sequel to Wasteland, so they made a game called Fountain of Dreams

The whole plot is about a group of mutant Clowns trying to take over Miami. At one point you find a friendly Witch Doctor who helps you infiltrate the "Killer Clown College" where you find out why the Killer Clowns are so violent. The Plot and Gameplay is just so shitty, that no game since has been able to top it.
We're talking about Fallout though. Not Fountain Of Dreams. Killers Klowns From Outer Space, no matter how well written would not fit in Fallout's setting.
 
Sadly I don't have a complex elaborate plot yet in my mind to explain it all (those who know me here know that I love coming up with complex plots).

I probably still would have wanted to do something with the Institute and a 'City of Tomorrow'/new hope for humanity, and suddenly Synths start to appear in the wasteland.
First the mechanical ones that attack settlements and caravans, and later on the more organic ones (I rather prefer the idea that their organic side is the result of cloning and grafting living tissue onto non mechanical parts) that start infiltrating settlements, all for some unclear goal.

I would like to keep the origin and background of the Synths more of a mystery similar to the Master and Unity in Fallout 1, and the Enclave in Fallout 2, and there being all kinds of bits of background information spread across the Commonwealth, and when the player starts putting these pieces together there is this 'a ha moment' when you see the complete picture.

Even in Fallout 3 I wanted that the Super Mutants did not appear as they are not suppose to be on the East Coast and in my take on Fallout 4 the Synths would completely replace them as higher tier enemies, those Tracers being the worst type of enemy you could run into. (think those fully augmented agents from Syndicate)

There would of course be some plot twist in which you can spare some of the Synths (not all are evil/want to exterminate humanity, something like that), explaining why there would still be some Synths roaming around in any follow up game on the East Coast, they like the remnants of the Master's Army and the remnants of the Enclave being just another group of survivors trying to find a place in this new world.
But unlike the first two the mechanical Synths can still increase their numbers to a small degree.

But it would be to obvious that even if tried to separate the Institute from the Synths that there would be some kind of connection any way as they are the most advanced society on the East Coast with the technology to build them. (I would like to have made it that the Institute is instead a group descended from Pre War scientists, scholars, technicians and so on who returned to the surface to rebuild civilization and giving humanity a new future, explaining that City of Tomorrow they are building on the ruins of Boston)
 
Well, we did have that clown killer in Point Lookout... And we got Zetans... So... A Zetan who's a huge fan of the clown killer from Point Lookout goes down to earth to revive the glory of the serial killer?

[edit]

Anyway, we're getting besides the point of the thread now. Synths, I don't really get how they can be flesh and blood. It's like they half-assed Harkness from FO3 and just used the same old human gore animations and by Fallout 4 they were like "well, shit, I guess we gotta find some way to make sense of this".
@Tagaziel said that they used FEV in their creation of the synths but I still don't see how FEV can be used like that.
Synths should never have been "flesh and blood".
 
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Guys, stop giving them ideas...

I doubt that Bethesda is checking this place, and even then Fallout 4 is already made and published, little we can do about it.
I just started this thread to see what our own ideas would be like for introducing Synths.

Synths should never have been "flesh and blood".

Yeah I would also rather like to stick with that idea but then the 'infiltration angle becomes a bit more difficult', and to me the idea that the difference between robots and synths is that the last group includes models that can pose as humans. (thus having to come out as somewhat 'fleshy', having fake blood, bad breath etc.)

Would people here have objected if I had gone with a storyline of 'Synths believe themselves to be new humanity and want to replace the old one'?
Bit of a trope as it is kind of like the Super Mutants and the Master wanting to replace old humanity, and the Enclave wanting to cleanse the Earth of all mutant humans to make room for the true and pure humanity.

Edit: I would have cut all the 'FEV used in their construction' bit or 'pure human DNA' out.
 
Killer clowns could work as a silly one-off mission. The player meets a group of friendly retired raiders. They're all old and tired of fighting, and have worked hard to create good will with the locals, settling down so as to enjoy their twilight years. A member of the group, Trembles takes a shine to you, so much so, he wants to spend the night doing a ton of chems together. Sometime during the drug fueled night, Trembles hears something just outside his tent. You both run out to see a flying saucer! Killer clowns beam down and attack. The two of you manage to kill them all off, and exhausted from all the fighting, you both pass out in the pasture. In the morning the two of you discover dozens of slaughtered cattle. Turns out it was all a bad hallucination. Now you and Trembles are in trouble with the raider leader, and unless the two of you can find an alternate food source, this old raider gang might be forced to go back into the raiding game. Thus starts your adventures with Trembles and the terrible flashbacks of Killer Clowns that appear at random in bars, amongst trees in the distance, and in the heat of battle.
 
Killer clowns could work as a silly one-off mission. The player meets a group of friendly retired raiders. They're all old and tired of fighting, and have worked hard to create good will with the locals, settling down so as to enjoy their twilight years. A member of the group, Trembles takes a shine to you, so much so, he wants to spend the night doing a ton of chems together. Sometime during the drug fueled night, Trembles hears something just outside his tent. You both run out to see a flying saucer! Killer clowns beam down and attack. The two of you manage to kill them all off, and exhausted from all the fighting, you both pass out in the pasture. In the morning the two of you discover dozens of slaughtered cattle. Turns out it was all a bad hallucination. Now you and Trembles are in trouble with the raider leader, and unless the two of you can find an alternate food source, this old raider gang might be forced to go back into the raiding game. Thus starts your adventures with Trembles and the terrible flashbacks of Killer Clowns that appear at random in bars, amongst trees in the distance, and in the heat of battle.
10/10.
 
Killer clowns could work as a silly one-off mission. The player meets a group of friendly retired raiders. They're all old and tired of fighting, and have worked hard to create good will with the locals, settling down so as to enjoy their twilight years. A member of the group, Trembles takes a shine to you, so much so, he wants to spend the night doing a ton of chems together. Sometime during the drug fueled night, Trembles hears something just outside his tent. You both run out to see a flying saucer! Killer clowns beam down and attack. The two of you manage to kill them all off, and exhausted from all the fighting, you both pass out in the pasture. In the morning the two of you discover dozens of slaughtered cattle. Turns out it was all a bad hallucination. Now you and Trembles are in trouble with the raider leader, and unless the two of you can find an alternate food source, this old raider gang might be forced to go back into the raiding game. Thus starts your adventures with Trembles and the terrible flashbacks of Killer Clowns that appear at random in bars, amongst trees in the distance, and in the heat of battle.
Love it.

But you could work in Edward Penishands in an illusion if you wanted to. I don't really think it counts. I mean 'real' killer klowns from outer space. Not an illusion. Not some guy in a mask. Not even zetans. I'm talking about real killer klowns that are a clown looking extra terrestrial race that comes to earth and wraps people up in cotton candy cocoons so that they can drink them with swirly straws. Who uses the kind of outerworldy zany "weapons" like they do in the movie. One of the clowns uses his hands in the light to create shadowpuppets and entertains some people at a busstop before turning the shadow into a dinosaur who then proceeds to eat the people whole (a shadow on the wall eating literal people).

I'm saying you can't work that into Fallout proper. No matter how it is written it is one of the cheesiest things I've ever seen and it would clash with the tone of Fallout way too much. I mean, Fallout 2, anyone? It would've been way too much for even that game.
 
Honestly I don't think Harkness was that bad in FO3. We had no idea how stupid and hypocritical the Institute really was back then, and Dr. Zimmer during that quest made it very clear that Harkness was the only Gen 3 synth, and that it took decades to perfect him. Thus, without him, they would be set back decades worth of research.

Now here's what doesn't make sense: Zimmer clearly states they would be set back DECADES if they don't get Harkness back since he was the first Gen 3 synth, but apparently the canon ending to that mission is that you kill Zimmer and let Harkness go free, since Fallout 4 takes place 10 years after Fallout 3 and Zimmer still hasn't returned or sent any form of contact to the Institute, according to the person who took over his job. So therefore, there should only be Gen 1 and 2 Synths by the time Fallout 4 came around. They literally would not have the technology to make more Gen-3s because of Harkness managing to escape. As I said, he was the FIRST Gen-3. You could argue that they could always make more, but Zimmer really seemed to drive the point home that if they didn't get Harkness back, the Institute was fucked research-wise. If they hadn't made Zimmer so passionate about getting Harkness back then this would make more sense, but the fact is, from the way he talks about it, if Harkness was never brought back, Gen 3s by the time of FO4 shouldn't be a thing.
 
Just suggest it to Bethesda and wait for Fallout 5:
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Please don't give them ideas.



Synths could've worked if it wasn't the equivalent of "Nanomachines son". Synths in Fallout 4 to me are simply human look a likes with a synth component you pick up on death with no other "synth components" or synth insides to prove it. I mean how the hell does that work?
 
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