FO2- Your Ideal Squad? (RP and Vanilla)

[SnapSlav]

So, I played me a buncha FO2 over the years. I started off by playing it like it was FO1, and had a really tough time. I began to consult the guide when I became incredibly lost as to what to do. I would go back and replay the game to "do it better" after all that I'd learned in my experiences. I would play with every character using Fast Shot, then with time and experimentation, I would convert to picking other Traits so I could take targeted shots. I would play characters who were saints, and characters who were calculated sociopaths. I would play characters who sneak into military bases and play most of the game solo, not avoiding combat but finishing the end of the game by not battling the entire level of its enemies. I would play characters who could assemble a motley crew that would dominate the wasteland, and eventually tackle EVERY location and clear out all of my enemies.

I did enough that I figured I knew what "the best" crew was to assemble. Then I tried out the RP. Just like my first excursions into FO2, playing it mistakenly like it was still FO1, I treated the RP much like it was still the vanilla game. It messed with my sense of pace, so when I found new places to explore, but I was used to heading East whereas this would take me South, I was confused and torn. Eventually, it dawned on me that with changes to the NPCs and new possible recruits, my "ideal squad" wasn't necessarily so ideal, anymore. So it got me thinking, what's the "best" squad to assemble?

In vanilla FO2, I would go out of my way to recruit Sulik (as everyone does), then Vic, then Cassidy, then Marcus, and finally Skynet. I made sure to have the first 3 as soon as possible so that they'd get plenty of levels along my journey, thus turning Vic into a very respectable shot, and Sulik into a diabolically beefy tank. Marcus was always my most favorite companion as far as personality went, but my least favorite as far as what he offered in combat. Being pretty tough without armor but ultimately the most vulnerable by the end of the game and being unable to equip any hard shitting SINGLE shot weapons and requiring VERY expensive maintenance made him more of a trophy than a valued asset to my team. Just like Ian in FO1, I would dread seeing Marcus' turn come up, especially if he positioned himself like shit.

In RP FO2, I'm still quite undecided about what my favorite team would be. Perhaps drop Sulik off eventually in favor of other companions who can use rifles, but keep him around for a while until that time comes. Keep Vic and Cassidy and Skynet, make a point of hitting up The Abbey while in Marcus' company so he can last into the late game, and seek out Kitsune (or maybe Cat) ASAP at the EPA. I never installed a Miria mod, so I don't intend to become married and end up with a considerably better companion than the worthless waste of companion space their vanilla counterpart amounts to. But the thought of getting married had occurred to me. I'm also clueless as to the new Lenny's strengths and weaknesses, so if I can give him a Gauss Rifle and Power Armor and he can become a regular force to be reckoned with, I'm as-yet unaware of the possibilities.

So many choices! So, who do you guys like to run with, WHEN you run with a squad?

 

[Magnus]

Pretty much what you said, although I usually get Goris instead of Skynet. I use F2WR (of course), which turns the Bozar into a high-powered single shot sniper rifle... hello Marcus, guess what, today is your birthday.
Sulik is with me all the way. At first I give him the 10mm SMG, then the 14mm pistol (F2WR makes it good), then the .223 pistol, then the HK P90C which I usually let him keep because of the AP ammo (which is good in F2WR), until I have enough ammo to give him the HK G11.

Cat Jules is the obvious choice for NPCs from the EPA, but I haven't even got to the EPA yet, so I only know what I've read about him from the guide.

Marcus is wearing Metal Armor as far as the game is concerned, which means he has NO Electrical resistance, and that makes him vulnerable to Enclave patrols with pulse pistols. If you pick up the

Spoiler

armor for him in the Abbey

he gets Combat Armor, which is much better but still leaves him vulnerable to plasma and heavy weaponry.

 

[naossano]

You can take Lenny until you need a free spot in your party.

 

[valcik]

Sulik FTW! He's a real bro, devoted and passionate, and he rocks really hard with 14mm/.223 pistol in RP. Followed by Cassidy very closely in my personal NPC popularity chart, because there's 6th level proto fixed in RP, which makes him shoot twice per round with almighty Gauss rifle.

I'll share my favorite combat tactics too - both Sulik and Cassidy are set to "Stay where you are", so they don't run like a mindless chickens on the battlefield. Very rewarding in fight against Metzger for instance, although only hardcore duders who don't save during their combat would appreciate it the most.

I'm sticking with CHA 4 mostly, that's why the other NPC are neglected somewhat, pickung them up temporarily or not at all.

I use F2WR (of course), which turns the Bozar into a high-powered single shot sniper rifle... hello Marcus, guess what, today is your birthday.

True that. The same goes for Megamod too, because MIBOB went totally insane with Bozar, making it even more powerful instrument of doom than WR does! Marcuss approved.

 

[SnapSlav]

I use F2WR (of course), which turns the Bozar into a high-powered single shot sniper rifle... hello Marcus, guess what, today is your birthday.

Ugh, I thought about that when I was installing the RP again, but I decided against it because the last time I installed both (2012-ish, so this is before they were both improved upon) there was some compatibility issues I ran up against. Making Marcus a massive Sniper sounds like it'd be sweet. Pity I can't try that this time around. I'll be sure to make a note of that for the future!

Sulik is with me all the way. At first I give him the 10mm SMG, then the 14mm pistol (F2WR makes it good), then the .223 pistol, then the HK P90C which I usually let him keep because of the AP ammo (which is good in F2WR), until I have enough ammo to give him the HK G11.

Cat Jules is the obvious choice for NPCs from the EPA, but I haven't even got to the EPA yet, so I only know what I've read about him from the guide.

Stats-wise, yes, Cat looks "better" than Kitsune. But I gotta say, there's something really endearing about Kitsune, as a character. It's a bit of a contradiction on my part, I know. Sulik is awesome as a character, yet I feel like he outlives his usefulness in terms of utility, but here I am wanting a sneaky assassin with a heart of gold to tag along with me instead of some badass army vet with fangs. But like I said, new choices have been leaving me torn. If I could have BOTH of them instead of Sulik and Marcus, I'd drop them both in a HEARTBEAT! But alas, no such luck. =(

You can take Lenny until you need a free spot in your party.

I do that with Myron, too. I pick him up just long enough to threaten to ditch him until he spills the beans about the EPA, then I ditch him anyway and head over there to pick up a much more useful companion! XD But I was wondering if the newer Lenny was particularly valuable for the long run, otherwise I'd keep Sulik.

If Sulik could use a Gauss Pistol... imagine the possibilities!

I'll share my favorite combat tactics too - both Sulik and Cassidy are set to "Stay where you are", so they don't run like a mindless chickens on the battlefield. Very rewarding in fight against Metzger for instance, although only hardcore duders who don't save during their combat would appreciate it the most.

I'll get around to an "Iron Man" run eventually. I just know it'll be much slower going, cause I'll be WAY more cautious, and right now I just wanna get deep into this game so I can see all the new and changed shit I either never reached or don't remember very well. (I did everything there is to do in the EPA, but I don't remember it all that well, so it'll be KINDA like a fresh experience, to me!) So caution to the wind and haste and all that...

I prefer setting as many companions to "On your own" rather than "Stay where you are". They're much less reliant on my positioning, which is crucial when I'm trying to be tricky with corners to fuck with enemies hitting me. Meanwhile, the times I used the "Stay where you are" setting on long-range shots in the past left me with a negative experience, because they relied ENTIRELY on where they were standing when combat began. On the one hand, none of this bullshit where they suddenly get the brilliant idea to run into a room and get mowed down by 5 guys in 1 turn. But on the other hand, if they're in a less-than-ideal position when the fight starts, they STAY in a less-than-ideal position the entire time. >_<

So how future-proofed is the .223 pistol on Sulik in the RP? I LOVED that weapon in FO1... but this ain't FO1. I was afraid that by the end of the game, Sulik would be little more than a tank.

 

[beans00]

me
davin
myron
skynet with monkey brain
robodog
k-9
pariah dog



that my crew

 

[Magnus]

I use F2WR (of course), which turns the Bozar into a high-powered single shot sniper rifle... hello Marcus, guess what, today is your birthday.

Ugh, I thought about that when I was installing the RP again, but I decided against it because the last time I installed both (2012-ish, so this is before they were both improved upon) there was some compatibility issues I ran up against. Making Marcus a massive Sniper sounds like it'd be sweet. Pity I can't try that this time around. I'll be sure to make a note of that for the future!

Sulik is with me all the way. At first I give him the 10mm SMG, then the 14mm pistol (F2WR makes it good), then the .223 pistol, then the HK P90C which I usually let him keep because of the AP ammo (which is good in F2WR), until I have enough ammo to give him the HK G11.

Cat Jules is the obvious choice for NPCs from the EPA, but I haven't even got to the EPA yet, so I only know what I've read about him from the guide.

Stats-wise, yes, Cat looks "better" than Kitsune. But I gotta say, there's something really endearing about Kitsune, as a character. It's a bit of a contradiction on my part, I know. Sulik is awesome as a character, yet I feel like he outlives his usefulness in terms of utility, but here I am wanting a sneaky assassin with a heart of gold to tag along with me instead of some badass army vet with fangs. But like I said, new choices have been leaving me torn. If I could have BOTH of them instead of Sulik and Marcus, I'd drop them both in a HEARTBEAT! But alas, no such luck. =(

You can take Lenny until you need a free spot in your party.

I do that with Myron, too. I pick him up just long enough to threaten to ditch him until he spills the beans about the EPA, then I ditch him anyway and head over there to pick up a much more useful companion! XD But I was wondering if the newer Lenny was particularly valuable for the long run, otherwise I'd keep Sulik.

If Sulik could use a Gauss Pistol... imagine the possibilities!

I'll share my favorite combat tactics too - both Sulik and Cassidy are set to "Stay where you are", so they don't run like a mindless chickens on the battlefield. Very rewarding in fight against Metzger for instance, although only hardcore duders who don't save during their combat would appreciate it the most.

I'll get around to an "Iron Man" run eventually. I just know it'll be much slower going, cause I'll be WAY more cautious, and right now I just wanna get deep into this game so I can see all the new and changed shit I either never reached or don't remember very well. (I did everything there is to do in the EPA, but I don't remember it all that well, so it'll be KINDA like a fresh experience, to me!) So caution to the wind and haste and all that...

I prefer setting as many companions to "On your own" rather than "Stay where you are". They're much less reliant on my positioning, which is crucial when I'm trying to be tricky with corners to fuck with enemies hitting me. Meanwhile, the times I used the "Stay where you are" setting on long-range shots in the past left me with a negative experience, because they relied ENTIRELY on where they were standing when combat began. On the one hand, none of this bullshit where they suddenly get the brilliant idea to run into a room and get mowed down by 5 guys in 1 turn. But on the other hand, if they're in a less-than-ideal position when the fight starts, they STAY in a less-than-ideal position the entire time. >_<

So how future-proofed is the .223 pistol on Sulik in the RP? I LOVED that weapon in FO1... but this ain't FO1. I was afraid that by the end of the game, Sulik would be little more than a tank.

The .223 is the only gun of Sulik's that does squat against Enclave troops. I don't remember if the HK G11E has the submachine graphics, if it does then that's probably better. But the best weapon for him is the Mega Power Fist. Crazy high damage and armor penetration.

The F2WR protos have been updated for the latest RP, you can install it on an existing savegame if you want.

 

[SnapSlav]

The F2WR protos have been updated for the latest RP, you can install it on an existing savegame if you want.

Ooh, can I, now? That does sound tempting...

Guess I forgot about the Power Fists. I might go with Sulik, Vic, Cassidy, Skynet, Cat in the end, since Sulik ends up OUT-tanking Marcus eventually...

 

[Magnus]

I am putting out v2.3c tomorrow, it has some fixes to the random encounters and a pretty nifty Unarmed change (no Knockback on the special kicks and punches).

Also, did you forget that Marcus can use the companion-friendly Turbo Plasma Rifle and Pulse Rifle, which no one else in your party can? Those weapons rock, especially the Pulse Rifle is tremendously effective even on Horrigan.

When I get Marcus I usually set my companions to stay where they are with sniping weaponry, while he tanks with the Minigun. I pick up a Flamer for him around New Reno (Aliens in the EPA and Wanamingos in Redding have NO fire resistance), then go clear out Vault 15 and trade the loot for an Avenger minigun in NCR. Then I visit Vault 13 and get the Military base on the map, where he makes short work of his former mutant friends with the Avenger. After that I have enough Plasma rifles and Flamer fuel for him to start the apocalypse.

If all else fails he makes a decent support grenadier with EMP grenades if you set his weapon preference to None, for raiding the SAD.

 

[SnapSlav]

Don't forget, those were second generation Super Mutants. They were never "former friends" of Marcus'. =P

But it's BECAUSE I remember that Marcus can use the Plasma Rifle and Pulse Rifle that I'm not fond of his weapon prospects. Those weapons SUCK in FO2. I'm not all that keen to see how they differ between the vanilla version and the modded version that's applied by default by the RP. I'd much rather an option that would have kicked ass much more from the start, but wasn't available to me until now. e.g. "Another human who can wear PA and APA and wield a Gauss Rifle or Gauss Pistol" is filled in by Kitsune or Cat. So that makes 3 who meet that criteria, and 2 others who only meet half of that criteria.

So it comes down to what I want to fill in those last 2 slots with. Because he can repair himself for free inbetween combat and uses Gauss Rifles to deadly effect, I prefer Skynet for the 4th, despite being incapable of wearing ANY armor. So it pretty much leaves the 5th spot up in the air, and picking between Sulik and Marcus is like picking an Apple or a Peach. Both are delicious, and I like both, but I wish there was a clear winner between the two. In the non-metaphorical sense, both have great personality, and both can wreck utter havoc with the Mega Power Fist and tank like beasts, but neither of them feels like a clear winner.

If I used the F2WR, that might be quite different. But at the moment I'm still not. (Kinda shocked to see how frequently you still update it!) Out of curiosity, does that mean that if you give Marcus the modded Bozar that he fires it from the hip like he's holding a Plasma Rifle, but he's still technically "sniping" with it? Or does he have any new and special animation for it? Cause that's..... an odd image.

 

[beans00]

Don't forget, those were second generation Super Mutants. They were never "former friends" of Marcus'. =P

But it's BECAUSE I remember that Marcus can use the Plasma Rifle and Pulse Rifle that I'm not fond of his weapon prospects. Those weapons SUCK in FO2. I'm not all that keen to see how they differ between the vanilla version and the modded version that's applied by default by the RP. I'd much rather an option that would have kicked ass much more from the start, but wasn't available to me until now. e.g. "Another human who can wear PA and APA and wield a Gauss Rifle or Gauss Pistol" is filled in by Kitsune or Cat. So that makes 3 who meet that criteria, and 2 others who only meet half of that criteria.

So it comes down to what I want to fill in those last 2 slots with. Because he can repair himself for free inbetween combat and uses Gauss Rifles to deadly effect, I prefer Skynet for the 4th, despite being incapable of wearing ANY armor. So it pretty much leaves the 5th spot up in the air, and picking between Sulik and Marcus is like picking an Apple or a Peach. Both are delicious, and I like both, but I wish there was a clear winner between the two. In the non-metaphorical sense, both have great personality, and both can wreck utter havoc with the Mega Power Fist and tank like beasts, but neither of them feels like a clear winner.

If I used the F2WR, that might be quite different. But at the moment I'm still not. (Kinda shocked to see how frequently you still update it!) Out of curiosity, does that mean that if you give Marcus the modded Bozar that he fires it from the hip like he's holding a Plasma Rifle, but he's still technically "sniping" with it? Or does he have any new and special animation for it? Cause that's..... an odd image.

is you think the plasma rifle sucks i dont think you were very good at fallout 2 ^.^

 

[naossano]

me
davin
myron
skynet with monkey brain
robodog
k-9
pariah dog



that my crew

It might suck a bit more if you replace Davin by Maria and pick the abnormal brain.

 

[SnapSlav]

Spoiler

It might suck a bit more if you replace Davin by Maria and pick the abnormal brain.

You're acknowledging a troll... Don't do that.

Well, having reached Gecko and deciding to invite Lenny on a whim, it has occurred to me that SEVERAL whim decisions have rather fortuitously resulted in an unexpectedly sweet companion option! I decided to install the new model for Lenny, confident that I wouldn't find much use for him (as I remembered him being a less-than-stellar companion, only marginally more useful than Myron), and then when I reached Gecko, with 3 companions and 8 CH, I thought "Why not?" and decided to invite him along. Then I find out he's a decent rifle shot!

Reading the RP guide, I found a comment that said that the model change- besides preventing him from running and thus making him a slow character who always falls behind -makes him proficient with rifles instead of pistols and SMGs! Well I'll be damned! So now I have a companion who can wear armor, and use rifles. So now all I need to concern myself with is whether his Small Guns skill has decent or shitty progression.

It's obvious that the different model for Lenny is not compatible with the NPC armor mod, which is a shame. But then again, would the old Lenny model, if outfitted in power armor, ALSO be able to use rifles, because of the different animations granted by the standard power armored critter? =D

I'm just exploring, and I as of yet dunno how longevital of a choice Lenny is. But for the time being he's been proving himself a very capable asset! ^^

 

[Magnus]

Spoiler

It might suck a bit more if you replace Davin by Maria and pick the abnormal brain.

You're acknowledging a troll... Don't do that.

Well, having reached Gecko and deciding to invite Lenny on a whim, it has occurred to me that SEVERAL whim decisions have rather fortuitously resulted in an unexpectedly sweet companion option! I decided to install the new model for Lenny, confident that I wouldn't find much use for him (as I remembered him being a less-than-stellar companion, only marginally more useful than Myron), and then when I reached Gecko, with 3 companions and 8 CH, I thought "Why not?" and decided to invite him along. Then I find out he's a decent rifle shot!

Reading the RP guide, I found a comment that said that the model change- besides preventing him from running and thus making him a slow character who always falls behind -makes him proficient with rifles instead of pistols and SMGs! Well I'll be damned! So now I have a companion who can wear armor, and use rifles. So now all I need to concern myself with is whether his Small Guns skill has decent or shitty progression.

It's obvious that the different model for Lenny is not compatible with the NPC armor mod, which is a shame. But then again, would the old Lenny model, if outfitted in power armor, ALSO be able to use rifles, because of the different animations granted by the standard power armored critter? =D

I'm just exploring, and I as of yet dunno how longevital of a choice Lenny is. But for the time being he's been proving himself a very capable asset! ^^

Believe it or not, Lenny can actually handle a Power Fist decently (his Unarmed skill is around 75-100%). He has a fantastic amount of HP, so if you want a tank, give him some armor and a Fist. His Strength of 4 is too low to handle most rifles, but the 60% bonus from the Scoped Hunting Rifle is more than enough to offset this, so give him that one if you want him to use rifles. Better set him to Stay Where You Are in that case, since he doesn't have much AP.

The Pulse Rifle is an extremely good weapon in unmodded Fallout 2, and the Plasma Rifle isn't far behind. I haven't changed the Pulse Rifle at all in F2WR, it's that good. I did give the Plasma Rifle the same stats as the Turbo Plasma Rifle (which makes Navarro incredibly dangerous), but the Turbo Plasma Rifle now fires for one less AP.

The Brain Bot has armor stats equal to Combat Armor, which isn't too bad, and it has tons of HP. It's probably the best NPC, but for some reason I never bother with it. Probably for the same reason that I never use Gauss weapons. My current end squad is Sulik (HK G11E), Vic(FN FAL HPFA), Marcus (Bozar) and Cassidy(XL703E). Goris simply died when I brought him to Navarro, but at least he lived long enough to visibly cut an Enclaveman in half with a critical hit. That was a glorious sight.

 

[SnapSlav]

Believe it or not, Lenny can actually handle a Power Fist decently (his Unarmed skill is around 75-100%). He has a fantastic amount of HP, so if you want a tank, give him some armor and a Fist. His Strength of 4 is too low to handle most rifles, but the 60% bonus from the Scoped Hunting Rifle is more than enough to offset this, so give him that one if you want him to use rifles. Better set him to Stay Where You Are in that case, since he doesn't have much AP.

Would power armor address his low ST? Obviously it would have little impact while he's only using Leather Armor and my best armor remains the Metal Armor I "procured" in Vault City, and I'm HOURS away from finding my first set of power armor (which will immediately to ME), but... it would fix that problem EVENTUALLY, would it not? As I said before, the long run is my focus. Since it takes so much time to level up your NPCs, so you're probably only going to be able to level the 5 you want to keep, at best, I wanted to make my plans before that time came. But the stats of the NPCs are what matter most. Lenny has great HP, but not as much AP, and I don't know what his Small Guns skill is at, nor how high it can reach. But if the overall total of his stats reaches a point that no less than rivals Vic's lategame, them I might just keep Lenny as my #4 and kick Sulik when the time comes! ^^

The Pulse Rifle is an extremely good weapon in unmodded Fallout 2, and the Plasma Rifle isn't far behind. I haven't changed the Pulse Rifle at all in F2WR, it's that good.

That's really not my memory of the weapon. I distinctly recalled my first character FLOUNDERING because he focused on Energy Weapons, as I confused the weapon progression of the game to reflect FO1's, which is did not. When I looked at the stats of the Pulse Rifle, I THOUGHT it would be the best weapon in the game for me, but it never pulled its weight. When I found Per's guide and I made a character stay specialized in Small Guns and I began using the Gauss Rifle, I finally realized what I'd been missing out on. It completely and utterly outperformed the Energy Weapons in every conceivable way, AP cost of the Turbo Plasma Rifle notwithstanding, of course.

Those were also the days of me always picking Fast Shot, as well, and I've long since "outgrown" that tendency. Aimed shots are a cherished pasttime, for me. It's always a delight to knock down somebody by shattering their shins or bruising their jewels... or regular vanilla concussions too.

I did give the Plasma Rifle the same stats as the Turbo Plasma Rifle (which makes Navarro incredibly dangerous), but the Turbo Plasma Rifle now fires for one less AP.

Which... y'know, just makes sense.

I'm familiar with your mod, I used it back in I believe 2010 or 2012 or so, I just had some crashing issues and was never able to complete my game at the time. I also read through the completed changelog, as I do with any patch/update/mod that interests me. Of course, reading through that much material and fully absorbing and understanding it all are different things, so I don't remember all the details off hand...

The only things I wonder about are: To what degree are weapons and ammo patched/modded in the RP (using Yet Another Ammo Mod [YAAM] selected by default), and what do the numbers mean? I read it all before, but time eats away at the things I've learned, so I don't quite remember how the damage modifiers work. Obviously an ammo with -4 DT would mean that it either negates or adds a phantom reverse DT (if the target's is low enough) when determining the damage dealt, but I don't understand what the 1/1 numbers mean, among other things. I coulda sworn that the native mod provided by the RP "resolved" the uselessness of AP ammo in FO2, but when I swapped out my JHP for AP in my Assault Rifle to tackle the Enclave Vertibird Assault Team after pissing them off at Gecko, my attacks seemed to be quite useless (barring the freak critical, as usual). Barely made it out of that fight alive... I get the idea that the F2WR makes shots MUCH more dangerous, and thus fights are much quicker (but the "ease" of lethality is a two-way street), but not understanding the exact formulas, I can't estimate to what degree they will differ.

 

[Walpknut]

Vic, Cassidy, Sulik, Goris and Marcus are my ideal crew (They were the party I beat the game with for the first time).
Vic would get Rifles and Shtoguns.
Cassidiy would get the Plasma guns, rifles, and the Solar pistol.
Marcus would get dumped with all the Big Guns and grenades.
Sulik would get the SMGs and the melee weapons.
Goris was just Goris.
I never liked Skynet or the Cyberdogs.

 

[SnapSlav]

So... Magnus... you never answered my question about what the various stats on ammo mean. =D

I kinda get that an AC Mod of -10 means it will bypass 10 points of AC, meaning it's..... more accurate? Okay scratch that, guess I don't get it. But anyway, I just remember reading up on how changes to ammo stats in FO2 were the explanation of why they behaved so differently than FO1 (and why burst fire just wasn't as awesome), but I don't recall the specifics. Had I remembered both the how and why, I probably would've been able to make more sense of what the ammo is like in the form of the RP I have installed, and exactly what differences your mod's changes would mean. After all, you can describe your intent, but if I don't understand the numbers, I won't understand what it actually DOES. I'm like that with Dota2 changelogs: I know exactly what every stat means, so reading "Base attack animation increased from 1.45 to 1.6" makes sense to me, because I know exactly what that does, versus "attack is slower" is much too vague for my understanding.

As for my party... I feel as though Lenny has outlived his usefulness. Man, that kinda sounds like a nefarious mob killer plot to bump off somebody he doesn't like! I just mean that it feels like Lenny doesn't quite carry the weight I was hoping for. I didn't quite realize that each NPC leveled a different number of times, so when I saw that Lenny was pretty much done leveling while Cassidy was still little more than halfway through, it occurred to me that I could be spending that "quality time" with someone else, and leveling them... whether or NOT I'm choosing to keep them around. So I'll be picking up Marcus, but I dunno if I'll be keeping him.

I've still got Sulik, Vic, and Cassidy, and I've got Kitsune with me (I just really like her personality), so Marcus will round out my party until I fix up Skynet a Brain Bot body to walk around in, at which point the difficult question of "Sulik or Marcus?" will have to be addressed. We'll see...

 

[Magnus]

So... Magnus... you never answered my question about what the various stats on ammo mean. =D

I kinda get that an AC Mod of -10 means it will bypass 10 points of AC, meaning it's..... more accurate? Okay scratch that, guess I don't get it. But anyway, I just remember reading up on how changes to ammo stats in FO2 were the explanation of why they behaved so differently than FO1 (and why burst fire just wasn't as awesome), but I don't recall the specifics. Had I remembered both the how and why, I probably would've been able to make more sense of what the ammo is like in the form of the RP I have installed, and exactly what differences your mod's changes would mean. After all, you can describe your intent, but if I don't understand the numbers, I won't understand what it actually DOES. I'm like that with Dota2 changelogs: I know exactly what every stat means, so reading "Base attack animation increased from 1.45 to 1.6" makes sense to me, because I know exactly what that does, versus "attack is slower" is much too vague for my understanding.

As for my party... I feel as though Lenny has outlived his usefulness. Man, that kinda sounds like a nefarious mob killer plot to bump off somebody he doesn't like! I just mean that it feels like Lenny doesn't quite carry the weight I was hoping for. I didn't quite realize that each NPC leveled a different number of times, so when I saw that Lenny was pretty much done leveling while Cassidy was still little more than halfway through, it occurred to me that I could be spending that "quality time" with someone else, and leveling them... whether or NOT I'm choosing to keep them around. So I'll be picking up Marcus, but I dunno if I'll be keeping him.

I've still got Sulik, Vic, and Cassidy, and I've got Kitsune with me (I just really like her personality), so Marcus will round out my party until I fix up Skynet a Brain Bot body to walk around in, at which point the difficult question of "Sulik or Marcus?" will have to be addressed. We'll see...

The AC mod behaves like you said, it affects accuracy.
The DR mod behaves the same, reducing (or increasing in the case of JHP) the DR of the defending armor.
The incredibly unintuitive 1/1 numbers (Damage mod) are actually one number! The / is a division sign, so 1/1 means just 1, and 1/2 means 0.5, 2/1 means 2, etc. The damage of the weapon is multiplied with this number before any armor calculations are made.

In F2WR I've given 10mm and 5mm ammo a monstrous 7/2 damage mod, so all weapons that use them do 3.5x damage... but the ammo also has a plus 46 to DR, which shaves it down to somewhere around 1.8x. The reason for this is to make each point of DR have a much larger effect than if the damage mod was just 1/1. The effect of this is that JHP is severely impacted by armor, to the point where it does less damage against Metal Armor than AP ammo. AP ammo now has a damage mod of 1/1, but reduces DR quite a bit, so it is the better choice against Aliens, Deathclaws, Super Mutants and Metal/Combat armor.

This is all using the default damage calculation in FO2, I've only changed the stats on the ammo. The mods in the RP leave the ammo as it is, but changes the damage calculation formula. I'm not sure how effective they are, because I've never tried them.

 

[SnapSlav]

The AC mod behaves like you said, it affects accuracy.
The DR mod behaves the same, reducing (or increasing in the case of JHP) the DR of the defending armor.
The incredibly unintuitive 1/1 numbers (Damage mod) are actually one number! The / is a division sign, so 1/1 means just 1, and 1/2 means 0.5, 2/1 means 2, etc. The damage of the weapon is multiplied with this number before any armor calculations are made.

In F2WR I've given 10mm and 5mm ammo a monstrous 7/2 damage mod, so all weapons that use them do 3.5x damage... but the ammo also has a plus 46 to DR, which shaves it down to somewhere around 1.8x. The reason for this is to make each point of DR have a much larger effect than if the damage mod was just 1/1. The effect of this is that JHP is severely impacted by armor, to the point where it does less damage against Metal Armor than AP ammo. AP ammo now has a damage mod of 1/1, but reduces DR quite a bit, so it is the better choice against Aliens, Deathclaws, Super Mutants and Metal/Combat armor.

Thanks for clearing that up. NOW it makes much more sense. Your description of your changes reminds me of some of my attempts to mod Warcraft (1!) ages ago... most things worked, except that my tweeking of the numbers had unexpected results because the system they existed in was still unchanged. Primarily healing spells were useless, and summons were trash. But in most circumstances, the numbers I toyed around with resulted in a much more interesting experience than the core game.

From not having played it yet (at least not with the current version of the game), it would sound to me like the only issue I'd take with your changes is that DT seems to matter very little, and the bulk of the emphasis is on the DR, which I'm not crazy about. I liked the balance of both making a big difference, and really hated how FO3 just made everything DR silliness. But like I said, haven't used it yet. So we'll see how I feel about it when it actually plays out!

I foresee several early quests (primarily guarding the brahmin from the wild dogs) will be a NIGHTMARE! ~_~

This is all using the default damage calculation in FO2, I've only changed the stats on the ammo. The mods in the RP leave the ammo as it is, but changes the damage calculation formula. I'm not sure how effective they are, because I've never tried them.

So, this is a bit of a concern. Any idea HOW it changes the calculations? I couldn't find any reference for it. Does your mod override the calculation changes in the RP, so it plays as if the combat were left "intact", or do they end up compounding one another?

Now that I've taken on Marcus as a replacement for Lenny (only using the Mega Power Fist, as I haven't picked up any Plasma Rifles for him yet), the prospect of a Super Mutant Sniper in my party when I play with the F2WR mod quite excites me!

 

[Magnus]

(...)
Thanks for clearing that up. NOW it makes much more sense. Your description of your changes reminds me of some of my attempts to mod Warcraft (1!) ages ago... most things worked, except that my tweeking of the numbers had unexpected results because the system they existed in was still unchanged. Primarily healing spells were useless, and summons were trash. But in most circumstances, the numbers I toyed around with resulted in a much more interesting experience than the core game.

From not having played it yet (at least not with the current version of the game), it would sound to me like the only issue I'd take with your changes is that DT seems to matter very little, and the bulk of the emphasis is on the DR, which I'm not crazy about. I liked the balance of both making a big difference, and really hated how FO3 just made everything DR silliness. But like I said, haven't used it yet. So we'll see how I feel about it when it actually plays out!

I foresee several early quests (primarily guarding the brahmin from the wild dogs) will be a NIGHTMARE! ~_~

(...)
So, this is a bit of a concern. Any idea HOW it changes the calculations? I couldn't find any reference for it. Does your mod override the calculation changes in the RP, so it plays as if the combat were left "intact", or do they end up compounding one another?

Now that I've taken on Marcus as a replacement for Lenny (only using the Mega Power Fist, as I haven't picked up any Plasma Rifles for him yet), the prospect of a Super Mutant Sniper in my party when I play with the F2WR mod quite excites me!

DT is still very important, because of how the damage calculation is handled:
First, the weapon's damage is multiplied by the ammo's Damage Mod. Then, armor DT is subtracted from this damage. And then, armor DR is subtracted as a percentage of the remaining damage.

This means that even with an ammo that gives -100 DR, a weapon like a Minigun (7-12 damage) will never be able to do any damage to someone in Advanced Power Armor (13 DT), because DT is applied before DR takes effect. (This is without taking critical hits into account.)

In short, DT is good against weapons with low single shot damage (burstfire weapons, knives, punches), but fails to protect against high-damage single shooters (Gauss, Plasma, Bozar, Spear, Super sledge), which is where DR becomes important.

I do not know how the optional damage calculation changes in the RP work, but F2WR's installer will automatically disable them so that they do not interfere.