Google and Verizon vs The Internet

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Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude

Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
There is some serious shit going down right now with Google and Verizon. I recommend you read one of the articles below , but here's a quick snippet from the first:



io9.com said:
The internet becomes a pay-to-play medium
The the Googlezon agreement includes a section where both companies pledge to keep the "public internet" completely neutral. Verizon says it won't privilege some services over others (unless they are "special services" or "mobile services," but we'll get to that). And for its part, Google pledges that it will keep all of its services on the public internet.

But what the hell is this "public internet"? Isn't all of the internet public? Obviously there are internal business and government intranets that are private, and pay-to-play services, but the internet itself is by definition public. So why all this talk from Googlezon about how they'll keep the public internet neutral?

One simple answer, my friend: Googlezon is redefining the internet as a tiered service, like cable. And this new thing called the public internet is the lowest tier. Kind of like network television is the lowest tier in your television service options. From here on out, you will start to see the internet equivalent of cable service online: For an extra ten dollars, you can get the "movie lovers" package, where your ISP privileges Netflix and Hulu traffic, giving them to you super-fast. For another ten dollars, you can get the "concerned parent" package, which blocks peer-to-peer traffic as well as websites that they consider to be pornographic. And so on.
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I'm not surprised in the least that Verizon is part of this shady deal, or even that Google has completely sold out like that. I'm just shocked this is happening so soon. We've all heard the internet doomsday scenarios about this sort of thing, but who would have thought it was right around the corner?

Once they go through with it, you know other ISPs will jump on-board and do the same damned thing.
 
Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude said:
I'm not surprised in the least that Verizon is part of this shady deal, or even that Google has completely sold out like that. I'm just shocked this is happening so soon. We've all heard the internet doomsday scenarios about this sort of thing, but who would have thought it was right around the corner?
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Yeah, see, this is all called "jumping to conclusions" on what will and will not happen.

Besides that "the internet" is not affected by this. Verizon customers are.
 
Quick, lets downlaod it all be4 the makes Inturnet illegal!!1

download.gif
 
There has been a LOT of speculation about this for a while now. And nearly everyone jumped to conclusions and was proven wrong within 2 days.

So let's just wait a moment and see what's really going on, shall we?
 
From Google's Blog

"MYTH: This proposal would eliminate network neutrality over wireless.

FACT: It’s true that Google previously has advocated for certain openness safeguards to be applied in a similar fashion to what would be applied to wireline services. However, in the spirit of compromise, we have agreed to a proposal that allows this market to remain free from regulation for now, while Congress keeps a watchful eye.

Bolding is my own.

http://googlepublicpolicy.blogspot.com/


It shouldn't matter which medium you choose. And I don't think I'll be renewing my Verizon contract.

What happens when all internet is wireless?
 
Of everyone who would mess up net neutrality, I think google would be at the bottom of the list. Hasn't Virgin been talking about doing this for years?
 
How would this be new? Pay €30 and you get 30GB, pay €40 and you get 80. Add €10 and you get a wireless connection. Add €5 to get access to movies at €1 per movie and €6 to get some online storage space. Whatever. It all costs something already.

I'm sure they'll add more pricey "services" soon enough and some companies will group these services and get rich that way, but what's new? Like anyone would freak out about it. Just pay the bill and be calm, just like you always do.

How public is the internet really? Do you really feel free over here? I don't. It's constant conditioning coming from all corners, in all shapes and colours, in sound and 3D. It's as controlled and managed as any other service out there. You are a bit naive if you think the internet belongs to the public. Drones.
 
alec said:
How would this be new? Pay €30 and you get 30GB, pay €40 and you get 80. Add €10 and you get a wireless connection.
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Yeah, that only happens in Belgium.
 
Sander said:
Yeah, see, this is all called "jumping to conclusions" on what will and will not happen.

Besides that "the internet" is not affected by this. Verizon customers are.
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Down here, you have two options for good, high speed internet. Road Runner and Verizon; with Verizon being the fastest for the best price (We don't have that draconian bandwidth limiting shit here).

Take Verizon out of the equation and we're left with one good ISP.
 
I don't see why all providers would jump on board. Some would definitely keep offering the same old service, and customers would probably flock to them, since they would be the ones offering the biggest bang for a buck.
 
fedaykin said:
I don't see why all providers would jump on board. Some would definitely keep offering the same old service, and customers would probably flock to them, since they would be the ones offering the biggest bang for a buck.
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Of course they'd jump on board. They'd do it for the same reason the big LCD manufacturers were conspiring amongst eachother to illegally fix prices:

Money, and lots of it.

Why wouldn't they go with the tiered approach, and then just sell the old service on the side as an "unlimited" plan (while jacking up the prices a healthy margin, of course)?
 
They wouldn't do that if it meant they'd get outcompeted by other providers not doing that.
 
alec said:
How public is the internet really? Do you really feel free over here? I don't. It's constant conditioning coming from all corners, in all shapes and colours, in sound and 3D. It's as controlled and managed as any other service out there. You are a bit naive if you think the internet belongs to the public. Drones.
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i dont live in china or austrailia like you do :)


and sea... i got 1 abbreviation for you which is 3 words...

QOS


Quality of Service

its a mechanisim on hardware to guarentee mission critical data.

voice is typically 2-3, management data is 4-5 and user data is usually around 8-9

all they really have to do is set the QOS value of these "premium" users to something like 2-3 and all of a sudden your packets get treated like royalty...

routers/switches prioritize data based on the QOS value... the lower the QOS value, the faster your data moves through the network.

QOS allows you to change the FIFO order most packets take. in the packet its labeled something like priority or such

when a packet for your ip enters the system such as your default gateway, it would just tag your packet as a relatively low priority, or when a packet for your IP enters the system it would get re-tagged with a low priority.

also, not only does the lower priority packet get serviced first on the individual devices, it could also allow for priority routing through their network and give you access to routing links not available for "normal" users.
 
Phil the Nuka-Cola Dude said:
Down here, you have two options for good, high speed internet. Road Runner and Verizon; with Verizon being the fastest for the best price (We don't have that draconian bandwidth limiting shit here).

Take Verizon out of the equation and we're left with one good ISP.
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Where do you live? Is it sort of "out in the boonies" or is it a more metropolitan area? Weird to me that you'd only have two options for internet access.

As for the topic, yeah I saw that a little while ago. It may or may not mean anything of significance... it just depends on what exactly comes out of this agreement Google and Verizon has. At worst, I may just stop using Google's services, utilize NoScript to make sure none of Google's scripts are running on any website I visit, and not use Verizon's services (which I don't use anyway). As Sander said, it's not likely that all the other ISPs will jump on board simply because any that don't will easily out compete those that do. If they all collude, I think there'll be a huge backlash and legal proceedings before long.
 
Sander said:
alec said:
How would this be new? Pay €30 and you get 30GB, pay €40 and you get 80. Add €10 and you get a wireless connection.
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Yeah, that only happens in Belgium.
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What? Seriously? You guys have one price for unlimited bandwith or what?

I'm flabbergasted.
 
alec said:
Sander said:
alec said:
How would this be new? Pay €30 and you get 30GB, pay €40 and you get 80. Add €10 and you get a wireless connection.
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Yeah, that only happens in Belgium.
Click to expand...

What? Seriously? You guys have one price for unlimited bandwith or what?

I'm flabbergasted.
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In the States you do unless you have Comcast. They very quietly capped their regular service and charge a crapload more for their unlimited service. One of my friends got a threat when they reached the cap that if they did it again that they would have to either buy the premium service or have their contract canceled (which, depending on the contract signed, may be a breach in contract on their side). The issue is fundimentally that companies are too fucking cheap to upgrade their networks. The States needs to switch to fiber optic already.

The limited bandwidth thing ended years ago.
 
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