NFL 2011

[Nology5890]

I'm starting this bitch early, with an interesting topic: Tiki Barber unretiring. It's sorta cool, because I liked watching that man run the ball, but I think he's going to take one good shot and realize that his rose-tinted visor of nostalgia shattered when he hit the turf. But that's just my opinion.

 

[Guiltyofbeingtrite]

I think he'll be fine, he probably won't get many touches but probably willing to accept the league minimum for an 11 year vet.

 

[Sander]

A 36-year old running back? I'll be surprised if he does more than just pass-protect.

People seem to think that the most logical place for him to sign is Tampa Bay, because the Bucs have Ronde. Please god no.

 

[DammitBoy]

A 36-year old running back? I'll be surprised if he does more than just pass-protect.

People seem to think that the most logical place for him to sign is Tampa Bay, because the Bucs have Ronde. Please god no.

You should totally join kharn in asshelmets fantasy football this year.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Tiki'll probably be more productive than the LDT and Thomas Jones types. It's his db personality and penchant for pulling his network analyst role by critiquing his own team midseason that's his biggest drawback. He's quite simply a tool, ask any Giants fan.


Anyway, impending lockout. Forget about players vs. owners, this is more about small market vs. big market. The JJs, Snyders, Luries, Krafts and NYC types want this to go away. When was the last time an NFL franchise ever lost a penny? Richardsons and Wilsons need to pull more of their own weight. NFLs record in court is disastrous. Let some of these small market teams fold, NFL, NBA, NHL, MLB - contraction leads to a more potent product.

I wish they'd go soft cap with a luxury tax like MLB. Money teams can still spend, and the small market teams can pocket the benefits.

March Madness, NBA and NHL playoffs, and that silly blurnball game, who cares? NHL finally realizing that taking fighting and mayhem out didn't bring in the mainstream that wouldn't watch it anyway, and going back to it's roots. No fear of 'devastating hits' and blood and carnage. Anybody see that Zdeno Chara hit the other day - no fine, no suspension, no self-righteousness. Montreal PD doing more than the commissioner. NFL lockout will be a boon for these other guys.

 

[UniversalWolf]

I wouldn't say Tiki can't do it until I see him fail. Ahman Green was useful for the Packers two seasons ago, and everyone thought they were crazy to sign him.

If there's no season in 2011, how do they pick the draft order for 2012?

I say every team selects a representative to compete in some sort of reality talent show, and the winner gets first pick.

 

[Sander]

I wouldn't say Tiki can't do it until I see him fail. Ahman Green was useful for the Packers two seasons ago, and everyone thought they were crazy to sign him.

If there's no season in 2011, how do they pick the draft order for 2012?

I say every team selects a representative to compete in some sort of reality talent show, and the winner gets first pick.

No CBA, no Draft after 2011 is my understanding. This draft is only happening because they agreed to it in the previous CBA. Not true for any subsequent drafts.

But there will be a season, one way or another. Too much money at stake.

 

[UniversalWolf]

No CBA, no Draft after 2011 is my understanding. This draft is only happening because they agreed to it in the previous CBA. Not true for any subsequent drafts.

Yeah, I get that. But what if there's a new CBA after the non-season but before the 2012 draft? Does Carolina get the first pick again? If so, they should for sure not take a QB this year, and bet the farm on getting Luck next year.

But there will be a season, one way or another. Too much money at stake.

I'm much less optimistic than you are. The owners and NFL management are arrogant beyond belief, especially when they want someone else to pay for something. I think they've planned for several years for there to be no 2011 season.

 

[Sander]

Yeah, I get that. But what if there's a new CBA after the non-season but before the 2012 draft? Does Carolina get the first pick again? If so, they should for sure not take a QB this year, and bet the farm on getting Luck next year.

Way too small a shot of that happening.

I'm much less optimistic than you are. The owners and NFL management are arrogant beyond belief, especially when they want someone else to pay for something. I think they've planned for several years for there to be no 2011 season.

I think they had contingency plan in place, yes, but no 2011 season is not healthy for anyone involved in this business. Besides, the owners' lockout pot of $4Billion in loans got struck down as illegal, so they're fucked anyway.

Even if it means the NFL imposes one-sided rules, there will be a season.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

there will be a season.

UFL! UFL! UFL!

College ball is a certainty, and they will gladly jump all over Sundays and Monday nights, given the opportunity. And they play for free (except at Auburn).

 

[Sander]

UFL! UFL! UFL!

College ball is a certainty, and they will gladly jump all over Sundays and Monday nights, given the opportunity. And they play for free (except at Auburn).

And every other top program.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Allegedly. But at least they have the discretion and good taste to do it behind closed doors. I don't really have a stake in who gets what cut of every plate of $8 nachos sold.

 

[Sander]

All the whining about being paid and agents and whatever every year makes for good hypocritical drama. I wonder which players will have their college careers ruined because they accepted some jewelry this year.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

All the whining about being paid and agents and whatever every year makes for good hypocritical drama. I wonder which players will have their college careers ruined because they accepted some jewelry this year.

By the time the NCAA acts, the offenders have already graduated/declared for the draft, and the ones left to be punished are underclassmen who probably weren't even there when the offenses happened.

How'd you like to be an incoming freshman to USC when the NCAA declared them bowl ineligible for your whole career because of something Reggie Bush did before you even got there. Then the coach who recruited you bolts for greener pastures and your incoming coach is Lane Kiffin, who just left his job because of NCAA sanctions. WTF. And what was Bush' ultimate punishment? He had to give a trophy back?

R. Bush and Cam Newton are like posterchildren for breaking NCAA rules and walking away clean while others deal with the fallout. Never affected their college careers.

 

[Sander]

By the time the NCAA acts, the offenders have already graduated/declared for the draft, and the ones left to be punished are underclassmen who probably weren't even there when the offenses happened.

Wellll, Robert Quinn and Marvin Austin would like to disagree.

How'd you like to be an incoming freshman to USC when the NCAA declared them bowl ineligible for your whole career because of something Reggie Bush did before you even got there. Then the coach who recruited you bolts for greener pastures and your incoming coach is Lane Kiffin, who just left his job because of NCAA sanctions. WTF. And what was Bush' ultimate punishment? He had to give a trophy back?

R. Bush and Cam Newton are like posterchildren for breaking NCAA rules and walking away clean while others deal with the fallout. Never affected their college careers.

Eh, they're not the cause. The cause of all this bullshit is the system, the recruiters and everyone else. I can't blame players for accepting lots of money when it's offered to them.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Robert Quinn and Marvin Austin

Never heard of them, can't have had much of a career to lose if they sold themselves for dope ropes. Cam Newton's dad wanted 6 figures just to transfer.

Eh, they're not the cause. The cause of all this bullshit is the system, the recruiters and everyone else. I can't blame players for accepting lots of money when it's offered to them.

The cause is not going to change. Too much vested interest.
Players who knowingly violate the rules of the NCAA are still subject to the rules, whether they are just or not.

My biggest gripe with College ball is the lack of a playoff. Meanwhile, they can't stop adding more teams to the basketball championship. BCS matchups almost seems rigged a lot of the times. A championship recently won by...a team under NCAA sanctions and investigation for improper phone calls or some foolishness (Go Huskies!).

 

[Sander]

Never heard of them, can't have had much of a career to lose if they sold themselves for dope ropes. Cam Newton's dad wanted 6 figures just to transfer.

Robert Quinn will be a top 10 pick while having missed the entire 2010 season. Marvin Austin will be a first-rounder after having missed the entire 2010 season. Both star players for North Carolina. That's how highly valued these guys were - guess how much better they could've been had they actually played in 2010.

The cause is not going to change. Too much vested interest.
Players who knowingly violate the rules of the NCAA are still subject to the rules, whether they are just or not.

And so are the people giving them money, which is often the programs themselves. College football is corrupt and everybody gets paid behind the scenes. The difference is who gets caught. Pretending that Reggie Bush and Cam Newton destroyed programs to walk away scot-free is silly, because it implies that all those other highly recruited and highly succesful college players never got paid. Bullshit. They just didn't get caught.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Never heard of them, can't have had much of a career to lose if they sold themselves for dope ropes. Cam Newton's dad wanted 6 figures just to transfer.

Robert Quinn will be a top 10 pick while having missed the entire 2010 season. Marvin Austin will be a first-rounder after having missed the entire 2010 season. Both star players for North Carolina. That's how highly valued these guys were - guess how much better they could've been had they actually played in 2010.

What a waste, they should've come out last year. What's the point of staying for an ineligible year if you're a top 10 pick?

Yeah, I don't follow ACC football so I don't know what they did.

College football is corrupt and everybody gets paid behind the scenes.

I think this is a dangerous assumption to operate on, and I'm not really comfortable opening that Pandora's box.
It's like debating who is or who isn't on 'roids. We know who's been caught, all else is speculation.

I don't think it's fair to the clean players and programs to cast such a wide net.

I mean, surely you're not suggesting Tim Tebow cheated.

The difference is who gets caught.

I'd say it's who they target. Probably everyone is in violation of some archaic recruiting rule. I question how they decide who to pursue and why.

Pretending that Reggie Bush and Cam Newton destroyed programs to walk away scot-free is silly, because it implies that all those other highly recruited and highly succesful college players never got paid. Bullshit. They just didn't get caught.

I don't understand what you mean by 'other players'. From USC? I don't know that Brian Cushing or Ray Maualuga got paid. I wouldn't be surprised, but I don't think you can just assume they were.

 

[Sander]

What a waste, they should've come out last year. What's the point of staying for an ineligible year if you're a top 10 pick?

Yeah, I don't follow ACC football so I don't know what they did.

Improper contact with agents or something. Also they were caught after the period for entering the draft and the supplemental draft was over, so they couldn't come out (plus I think they weren't draft eligible yet).

I think this is a dangerous assumption to operate on, and I'm not really comfortable opening that Pandora's box.
It's like debating who is or who isn't on 'roids. We know who's been caught, all else is speculation.

I don't think it's fair to the clean players and programs to cast such a wide net.

I mean, surely you're not suggesting Tim Tebow cheated.

Hawwwwwww.
I'm sure some programs are clean. I'm pretty sure most of them aren't. I'd be really surprised if Florida was clean.

I don't understand what you mean by 'other players'. From USC? I don't know that Brian Cushing or Ray Maualuga got paid. I wouldn't be surprised, but I don't think you can just assume they were.

I can certainly assume that more players around college football were paid than just two. I mean, that's just common sense. I don't know which individual players got paid, but I'm really sure more of them did than just Bush and Newton.

Actually, by your logic Newton hasn't been paid. All the improprieties involved his dad only. It's why he hasn't been suspended. And it didn't involve Auburn, but some other team. So he didn't even play for that program.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

That has less to do with 'my logic' and more to do with the NCAA's burden of proof. Just because we all know somebody did something, doesn't mean enough evidence exist to prosecute/convict. See: Simpson, Orenthal James.

I don't know which individual players got paid

Neither do I, nor which do 'roids. Until evidence comes forth that proves otherwise, I don't even want to open that can of worms to speculate. I'd rather some cheaters and juicers skate than taint everyone.