Proof to newcomers that NMA doesn't crucify Bethesda fans

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ZigzagPX4

ZigzagPX4

The Swiftness of the Ranger
Alright, first off, this may seem like a bit of a pointless post. I hope I'm actually posting in the right place. Also, if you're a regular of NMA (I'm relatively a newbie) then you aren't who I'm addressing, but feel free to stick around. I just wanted to post this out of a little of experience. Feel free to consider this dumb. :grin:

So if you're a fan of Fallout 3 or 4 or both, and you looked at the discussions around here and thought "I want to join in, but y'all too harsh on FO3, FO4 and Bethesda..." and considered leaving and never coming back, I ask you this:

If this forum is really full of people hateful of everyone who plays Bethesda Fallout games... where do all the screenshots of Fallout 3 constantly being uploaded come from? A lot of them certainly aren't there to mock the game.

And furthermore - why oh why would we have a Fallout 3 gameplay and tech help section if we weren't willing to help people with the game? Sure, I guess you could say it's to help them get pass the experience as fast as possible so they don't "suffer", but really it's that the place isn't some sort of haven of one-sided monsters. A lot of people here are critics, and even if you bring up something that's completely unrelated to Fallout, someone here is going to find flaws with it. It's a discussion forum. We're here to talk, not all circle around the same opinion again and again. And while it may seem that way with hating certain games, no one here is outright toxic.

Much like the minority of Bethesda fans, this site has its own fair share of the worst of our kind. As such, they are dealt with quickly by the authority here. Don't think that someone flinging a flurry of private messages on you being a disgusting coward for liking different, somewhat flawed games is the norm here. And finally, don't come in crashing through the door, questioning why the hell everyone's the way they are, because they just are. There's nothing wrong going on here.

The community's here for an exchange of ideas and viewpoints. We're not here to burn you alive for liking things. No one here will hate you for liking the things they don't like, just as long as you don't tell them it's wrong to not like certain things. That's all I wanted to say.

I don't know, maybe the people this post is meant for might never get here to read this. But I wanted to leave my personal impression of what NMA is. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm right. But this place is for sharing opinions, and this is me sharing mines. The fact that this exists is literal proof that you're allowed to say what you want! Just remember to not be outright hateful to the point of toxic behaviour, and remember to keep an open mind.

Not everyone is you. :wink:
 
Well that's a noble way to explain..uh...that but lets be honest we're probably always going to have a reputation like this where they'll inform others how radioactive this community is. For me I could care less what one person thinks of NMA because I know that this is a good, fun community and some silly opinions won't hurt my feelings.

In other words when it comes to "hurtful" lies from them, no fucks were given and this picture about those hurtful opinions should say it all(atleast for me):
 

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I don't mind the bad rep, it keeps most of the beth/todd cultists away.

Plus, this site would be even MORE weird than it is already if we go mainstream, yick.
 
I think crucify is what Bethfans would do to us if they got the chance, I mean oh look at us hating on Godd Howard, they shouldn't deserve to live...

If anyone thinks people here murderously hate Bethfans then they're too stupid to be here, I think NMA is fine with the rep it has, I mean I just discovered it and it's already one of my favorite reads lol
 
I don't think that it's really the fault of anyone on the site.

Constantly, in comments sections or Steam forums or other such places, there will be trolls who are just as bad, if not worse than Bethesdrones, and many people assume they're from here because of how much hatred they spew towards Bethesda and their fanbase. Hence the name "NMA trolls."

NMA is one of the best fansites around, but every so often, some retard will crawl from the radioactive muck and start seeding this horrible opinion of the site.
 
There are smart people who appear to be Bethesdrones just waiting to actually realise how crap the game they're playing actually is. This post is for them. It's not meant to make NMA look good for the trolls, it's meant to be an invitation to people who think Bethesda is shite too but are still on the fence about joining us because they think we're also trolls.

This is is an intellectual discussion site (and also there's the Order but I'm not allowed to talk about that) so having more friendly faces and opinions can always be a good thing. I'm not defending anything, I'm opening the doors to the doubtful but intelligent.
 
DarkCorp said:
I don't mind the bad rep, it keeps most of the beth/todd cultists away.

Plus, this site would be even MORE weird than it is already if we go mainstream, yick.
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I think it's better off to end up on the right side of the toxic/curmudgeonly line though. You certainly don't want to drive away people who might have something constructive or interesting to contribute simply because they're afraid they'll just be abused if they pop their head up. But, as you say, keeping the Bethdrones away because it's entirely clear that we're simply not impressed with how well a game sold sold, how well it reviewed, or how "awesome" you think it is. If you like a Bethesda game, and you're willing to get into why that is at a level deeper than "it was awesome" then for the most part people here are going to respect that.

But no, not everything needs to be mainstream. I know that elitism as a concept is largely frowned upon in modern society, but there's something to be said for people who have an uncommon level of interest or knowledge about something being able to discuss with others who are similarly inclined without having to keep the level of conversation down so the peanut gallery can follow. Like if two people want to discuss Kurosawa films, having seen all of them, you don't want to have to keep explaining stuff to someone who hasn't gotten closer to a Kurosawa film than "Star Wars."
 
I have no problem with people liking Fallout 3 and 4, just don't try to pass those off as better games than the originals. ;)
I have my own dirty pleasures as well so there's nothing wrong with NMA members enjoying the game. I just can't stand whenever I hear these silly arguments like "Fallout 3 and 4 are better than the original Fallouts because they have bad graphics and they use "outdated" mechanics".
Ill admit I've never been a fan of the chance to miss mechanic like "95% chance to hit at point blank range *misses* damn it damn it damn it". I wouldn't mind if it was toned down more and replaced with doing less damage the further away you are until your out of range but I guess the chance to hit mechanic isn't all that bad.
 
MercenarySnake said:
I have no problem with people liking Fallout 3 and 4, just don't try to pass those off as better games than the originals. ;)
I have my own dirty pleasures as well so there's nothing wrong with NMA members enjoying the game. I just can't stand whenever I hear these silly arguments like "Fallout 3 and 4 are better than the original Fallouts because they have bad graphics and they use "outdated" mechanics".
Ill admit I've never been a fan of the chance to miss mechanic like "95% chance to hit at point blank range *misses* damn it damn it damn it". I wouldn't mind if it was toned down more and replaced with doing less damage the further away you are until your out of range but I guess the chance to hit mechanic isn't all that bad.
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You miss like that? Woah, for me it was always balanced. Never had a problem with the chance to miss thing.
 
ZigzagPX4 said:
There are smart people who appear to be Bethesdrones just waiting to actually realise how crap the game they're playing actually is. This post is for them. It's not meant to make NMA look good for the trolls, it's meant to be an invitation to people who think Bethesda is shite too but are still on the fence about joining us because they think we're also trolls.

This is is an intellectual discussion site (and also there's the Order but I'm not allowed to talk about that) so having more friendly faces and opinions can always be a good thing. I'm not defending anything, I'm opening the doors to the doubtful but intelligent.
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I think a lot of the divide here just comes down to experience and perspective. I mean, anybody who played Fallout 1 or 2 when they were new falls easily into the "grognard" (literally "grumbler" a term for Napoleon's "Old Guard" who were allowed to complain openly in a way that less experienced folks were not) camp because it's been a while since those were new. If I was like 14 when Fallout 3 came out, I probably would have thought it was superlative.

But just in the way that your tastes in everything change as you gain experience and perspective (you realize the value in things you had previously not considered, you get sick of what you used to like, or you start recognizing merits or flaws you used to not notice), so do your taste in games. So no one's saying you can't enjoy Skyrim or Fallout 4 or whatever, but like every other work of fiction those two games are neither all good nor all bad. So being able to discuss stuff you like without resorting to a binary notion of quality is something that does take a bit of maturity.

So really the Bethesda fans who are willing to understand that criticisms of Bethesda games are not attacks on them; and that no one in history has made a game, book, movie, song, or sandwich that was without flaw; and that people are simply going to like different things in entertainment than other people like are more than welcome here. If you don't understand those things, then hopefully you will sooner or later.
 
PossibleCabbage said:
and that no one in history has made a game, book, movie, song, or sandwich that was without flaw
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Are you questioning the perfection of my sandwich?

In all seriousness, though, I think a lot of people here are angry at Bethesda (for very good reasons) and do lash out at their games, but they also tend to have reason and logic backing up those attacks. Bethesda's saner fans are angry at NMA because they feel like we're personally attacking them and want to send gaming back into the stone age (not a great reason, but still a reason) Contrast this with the folks on Steam or YouTube or crap like that, who give the good argument of "Bethesda/Interplay sucks/is awesome becauseshut up." Sadly, most of what either community sees are the trolls and mindless parrots.

On Steam and YouTube, I've had people tell me to kill myself because I didn't like Fallout 1. Those people are the reasons people have a bad image of NMA. It's something that really isn't our fault, and I can't figure out a way to fix it. It saddens me.
 
Ben Soto said:
On Steam and YouTube, I've had people tell me to kill myself because I didn't like Fallout 1. Those people are the reasons people have a bad image of NMA. It's something that really isn't our fault, and I can't figure out a way to fix it. It saddens me.
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You didn't like Fallout 1? Kill yourself. :smug:

That was a joke in case you are wondering.

A lot of people automatically associate fans of the old games with NMA when that isn't necessarily the case. Most people who bash this place haven't even posted here to see what it is all about. They think we mindlessly bash Bethesda at every opportunity, and hold Interplay and Obsidian up on some pedestal, but that couldn't be further from the truth. I think the community responded pretty well to a Fallout game that appealed to both the old fans and the new - Fallout: New Vegas. If Bethesda did more of that, we wouldn't be having this discussion as often. Make something closer to that in the Bethesda style (I guess) and you make more people happy.

If NMA crucified Bethesda fans we wouldn't have one as an administrator running the forum. Some people don't like their opinion being challenged. Many have never had a lengthy debate that didn't revolve around calling someone a retard if you disagree. I just witnessed someone dismiss Fallout 4 complaints - primarily how repetitive and boring it is - by saying they should just go play Call of Duty instead. I'm sure they missed the irony in that comment.

Threads like this shouldn't be required because it should be common sense that the entire community does not think the same. There are as many opinions here as anywhere else. Even the Codex has a Bethesda sub-forum. Sure, it gets a lot of hate but there are also a lot of fans in there. Now there is a lot of shit slinging from time to time, but I have found that is the case in most internet communities. It is good to let people know they are welcome despite all that. This community is what you make it.
 
I will TL;DR my point just for the sake of it. If NMA really was extremely hateful of Bethesda fans, it would not have a Fallout 3 tech help section, nor would it allow the posting of Fallout 3 screenshots unless they're made to mock the game. But it does both things because members here aren't single-minded tyrants.

It's simple logic, yet some people miss it when they arrive to complain about toxic Fallout 1 and 2 fans not from NMA, assuming that they did come from NMA.

This place is sort of the face of classic Fallout fans. There's not many other places to find them, so I guess this site takes all the shit for even the things people here don't do.
 
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