Submarine Mod

[Jotisz]

Is there any 3d modeler who wants to participate in this crazy and unique piece of art?

Anyone?

Would like but I unsure if my skills are enough

btw I just looked at the in-game screens they look pretty cool

 

[Lexx]

I think the best way to resolve this problem would be to make such thing:



In place of barrels computers/sonar console/radar console/etc. should be added since on 1st level a command center is located, left side can be only blocked by hex blockers...

Agreed. Place some junk there. Computers, tubes, random junk, etc. Or lets say: Create this as extra scenery so that one can add it if needed?

 

[Continuum]

...disappointing...

Disappointing? Why?

Maybe because isn't going to reflect crappy story about Chinese's awesome achievement - a palace from the hull (+ their stupid computer)?

To reflect this you must put the sub on the shore and remove most of hull and walls! And by doing this you'll kill a possibility of walking inside the sub and sinking the Tanker (conventional torpedoes can't fly in the air)... Not to mention about changing an appearance of thinking and talking computer's home...

Also, if exterior must the deconstructed then almost all cables/pipes from the walls must be removed and by doing this wall will look really boring... Otherwise there'll be no visual consistency between exterior and interior...

As for keeping, so called "Fallout Cannon": I don't care about this, really... Some of Fallout 2 design choices are on the same level of idiocy as Toddler's Booble Heads or Teddy Bear launcher... No less, no more...

Just saying...

Would like but I unsure if my skills are enough

Thanks for offering the help

I'll need some help with interior crap which won't be rendered with walls (in other words: separated scenery) and will be placed in the hull's center (since there may be some problems with left parts overlapping)... Any of existing art will not fit there/there's no such, so we'll need some custom ones... In this way I'll focus on the walls and exterior which are the most hard things to do...

Anyway, if you're still interested then I'll send you the geometry of each level:





Basing on that will be easier for you to fit stuff inside the hull/you'll see how large it is, where hexes are (not 100% accurate, but on a small surface differences are rather minimal) and such crap


And what is needed? I don't know... For the start maybe nuclear reactor? Engines? Later maybe parts of the command center? etc.

ATM I don't know if the stuff inside should be untouched, damaged or destroyed, really... I'm totally -->

Bow torpedo room I'll made by myself...

As for the texturing/rendering/adjusting/etc. - decision is yours. You can send me the geometry only and I'll do the rest or you do everything by yourself...

Agreed. Place some junk there. Computers, tubes, random junk, etc.

Yep, whole first level must be filled with such crap, because all is rounded... but then again if sub isn't going to be to much stripped then some nice command center could be done...

Or lets say: Create this as extra scenery so that one can add it if needed?

Yes, this is going to be separated scenery... but I'll add a large pipes to that round walls where blockers are placed...

 

[Josan12]

...disappointing...

Yes. I agree - i think it would be a real missed oppurtunity to leave out the deconstructed half of the first floor. I can't see any technical problems with it either.




This is looking great - i really like it. In regards to the problem with the curved wall: I agree that the 1st floor should be the only floor that will have this problem. In the plans i made the first floor is mostly the command center, which has control desks and computers lining almost all the outer walls. So if you can make some appropriate scenery to fit in there, it should solve the problem.

Here's a really basic concept of how i imagine the command room (though of course it would be much more deteriorated, rusty etc)




On a different subject - A few questions Continuum:

a) are you planning to make all the walls & scenery and then make the maps?
a) Do you want to make the maps yourself? Or someone else?
c) Do you think it might be better to make the main scenery (i.e. the walls), and then work on the map a little (you or whoever) and then go back to making some more scenery?
d) when i was making the test map in the mapper, i noticed it's not possible to make really narrow corridoors (as the door wall peices are too wide) Is it possible to correct this?

 

[Continuum]

i think it would be a real missed oppurtunity to leave out the deconstructed half of the first floor. I can't see any technical problems with it either.

I'm still not sure what exactly do you mean... walking in deconstructed parts of the 1st level?

But the most important thing is that whole sub isn't going to be visible, so making deconstructed part isn't a necessary thing and you can prevent from getting there from 1st level (doors are blocked, etc.)...

So, if you not able to see something and you can't enter into it, can you tell that this doesn't exits?

are you planning to make all the walls & scenery and then make the maps?

First walls must be done. Later scenery. Also, I'm sure there'll be a problem with tiles (sub's floor) which may be visible outside the hull (especially bow section), so someone will be forced to extract tiles that will be used and paint areas (with black or whatever the color of will be) which are going to be visible on the outside.

Do you want to make the maps yourself? Or someone else?

No, someone else will do the map. I'll provide all information (+ screenshots) how to build everything nicely, because walls are going to be little different than typical FO's walls. Also, it's better to work with RP files (since sub will be part of it) rather than with unmodded game... And I'm not going to install RP, since I'll get a nice mess inside scenery/walls folder (and in both scenery.lst)... I simply prefer to work with unmodded game

Do you think it might be better to make the main scenery (i.e. the walls), and then work on the map a little (you or whoever) and then go back to making some more scenery?

Yes, this is the best solution, since will be known how long the sub is. And if some scenery will be needed then you'll post a screenshot where do you want to put it and without any problems I'll be able to fit it nicely.

when i was making the test map in the mapper, i noticed it's not possible to make really narrow corridoors (as the door wall peices are too wide) Is it possible to correct this?

Well.. I'm not sure if 1st (and 3rd?) level is going to have any corridors... I think is too narrow... only sections separated by centered main doors are going to work best... but this can be changed later...

I'm not sure about 2 hexes wide (would be really hard to put such thing into the game), but I could be able to make 3 hexes wide corridor with the doorway that will fit into it.

But we must put into consideration party members... If player will go into such corridor with 5 party members and he'll try to get back then push button will be constantly used which isn't funny thing at all...

Anyway, it's better to re-think everything twice rather quickly implement some ideas. Because later there'll no place for any bigger changes...

 

[zenbitz]

For the sub... all the signs and computers etc. should use chinese. Which you don't know. But maybe you can grab a Shi NPC to translate?

I bet you could hack this with the Vic/Myron (Repair/Science) skill but for speech. The chinese stuff just requires a speech of 300 or something silly that only the NPC has.

 

[Continuum]

Here's how long segments are working in practice...



Between each segment there's exactly the same "hole" (the same Width). I'll make two type of small segments to fill this hole:

- "connection" with the straight wall,
- rounded wall (for very long room).

In this way you'll be able to make the sub as long as you want. To customize the look I'll make three (or maybe four) long segments with little a bit different details...

Also, at this screenie you can see tiles that are visible where they shouldn't be (outside the hull/where the water is/whatever). This I meant in my previous post...




Is there any way to disable this fucking highlight?







What do you think about darker, inner texture?

They're looking better (more rusty, old/etc.), I guess...

Day:



Night:

 

[Josan12]

Here's how long segments are working in practice...

Between each segment there's exactly the same "hole" (the same Width). I'll make two type of small segments to fill this hole:

- "connection" with the straight wall,
- rounded wall (for very long room).

In this way you'll be able to make the sub as long as you want. To customize the look I'll make three (or maybe four) long segments with little a bit different details...

Sounds good to me.

Also, at this screenie you can see tiles that are visible where they shouldn't be (outside the hull/where the water is/whatever). This I meant in my previous post...

Did you have a plan for what we are going to do for tiles outside the sub?

a) I guess the easiest option would be the default 'blackness'.
b) Maybe the semi-transparent 'water'??
c) For the 3rd floor - maybe the sea bed? - basicly sand, will some weeds - i could try to do make them. In the design doc i talked about the possibility of the player finding a way to get out onto the seabed through a hole in the flooded hull.... ? (cue the tentacles )

Is there any way to disable this fucking highlight?

Yeah, i remember having that problem with the last large peice of scenery i made. I'm sure i figured out a way by messing with the 'flags' but i could never replicate my sucess. Someone must know ...... ??????

What do you think about darker, inner texture?

They're looking better (more rusty, old/etc.), I guess...

Day:



Night:

I like it - i think it'd be most suitable for the semi-flooded/radiated/toxic 3rd floor. Can we use that texture for the 3rd floor, and keep the old ones for the 1st and 2nd? Or is that too complicated??

I'm still not sure what exactly do you mean... walking in deconstructed parts of the 1st level?

Here's another basic concept of how i see it in the mapper. It's very approximate only, just to give the idea:




You can see it uses the 'rings' structure idea brought up by someone previously in the thread. But i guess in the mapper they wouldn't reach up into a complete arch, so will look more like 'ribs' .....

But the most important thing is that whole sub isn't going to be visible, so making deconstructed part isn't a necessary thing and you can prevent from getting there from 1st level (doors are blocked, etc.)...

Well, yes, sure - but won't the sub be visible as a whole from the outside? I mean like part of the tanker is visible on the dock, the player goes through the door, and then inside is just different map levels. Standard RPG stuff But yes, that would mean the deconstructed part above would need to be seen on the 'outside' model..... aswell as the 'inside' map ....

 

[Continuum]

Did you have a plan for what we are going to do for tiles outside the sub?

Well, for sure this is going to be dirty work in PS!

I guess the easiest option would be the default 'blackness'

Yes, this is the easiest (this word sounds soo wonderful these days ) thing to do...

Maybe the semi-transparent 'water'??

With deeper = darker effect (+ caustics at the dock's floor and through the water) to complicate already complicated art?

For the 3rd floor - maybe the sea bed? - basicly sand, will some weeds - i could try to do make them.

Some sea floor for the bottom level could be done, I guess... but this is something I'm not planning to do ATM...

In the design doc i talked about the possibility of the player finding a way to get out onto the seabed through a hole in the flooded hull.... ? (cue the tentacles )

Stop! Otherwise I'm sure that another idea will pop up about some flooded, hidden cavern full of mutated sea critters and Sulik which is killing them with sledge in the underwater battle! And bubbles of course! I wonder how plasma projectile could look like under the water

Yeah, i remember having that problem with the last large peice of scenery i made. I'm sure i figured out a way by messing with the 'flags' but i could never replicate my sucess. Someone must know ...... ??????

I already tried flags without any results...

Can we use that texture for the 3rd floor, and keep the old ones for the 1st and 2nd? Or is that too complicated??

Yes, I wanted to ask about making 3rd level in different colors than others, since 90% of things from 1st are not going to fit into 3rd/from 3rd into 2nd/etc.

Well, yes, sure - but won't the sub be visible as a whole from the outside? I mean like part of the tanker is visible on the dock, the player goes through the door, and then inside is just different map levels. Standard RPG stuff .

As a whole - not (to cut the work). Only a part of it (few pages back I posted the image how this is going to look). And for sure deconstructed stern isn't going to be visible...

But yes, that would mean the deconstructed part above would need to be seen on the 'outside' model..... aswell as the 'inside' map ....

Yeah, I was suspecting such thing But then again really, really hard to do... and it's not only one reason why, but several... like waves that should go through the deconstructed part...

As I already said cool, but not necessary thing, really...

First I must get everything what is needed to work and than if I'll have a time then some of the extra features can be implemented, because in any time I'll be able to re-use existing geometry and make additional content from it.

 

[Darek]

Is there any way to disable this fucking highlight?

In flags, set 'Transparency None' to YES.
This is looking good by the way.

 

[Continuum]

I can't set Trans None to Yes, because it's a wall (transparency will be lost)! Besides, it's not working at all... engine still highlights everything...

--------------------------------EDIT

Or maybe misunderstood? I don't want to disable transparency when player is near. I want to disable highlight in night when player is near, because this outdated crap highlights whole piece, not only a part of it, which is looking awful.

Just look closely at the screenshot - right part is dark and look what happened with left part (all is highlighted!).

 

[Lexx]

The only good way would be to cut it in smaller pieces, imo because it seems like the flag in the mapper is broken or so. :/
I never could (de)activate it for some other big scenery pieces too.

 

[Continuum]

The only good way would be to cut it in smaller pieces.

Engine is staring to highlight 2 (or 3? I'm too lazy to check) hexes from that red hex which you can see in Frame Animator. So, to get a nice results I'll be forced to split long pieces (~ 230-320) into ~ 30 or less...

Fucking outdated crap

 

[Lexx]

The best thing will be to get every piece ingame. With tiles it is easy. The mapper remembers what the last tile was and jumps to the next automated. But with walls and scenery not. Heh. So the one who is "blessed" to create the proto files has to click very very much.

 

[Continuum]

The best thing will be to get every piece ingame. With tiles it is easy.

Don't forget about exterior... Splitting it into tiles in PS will be a fucking suicide (because you must split perfectly), not to mention about happy puzzling in Mapper!

----------------------------------EDIT

As I already said: this engine is preventing very well from making any bigger art... because of shitloads of unnecessary work you must do to get everything working nicely...

 

[Lexx]

Yes, but it looks great when it is done.

 

[Darek]

Yeah, sorry I misunderstood.

 

[Continuum]

Yes, but it looks great when it is done.

But if you'll produce too much tiles for one mod/TC then you won't be able to put your huge and awesome art into the game! Because there's a limit how many tiles can be present, which is 4096. So, only additional 1000 is possible

 

[Lexx]

Hmm... then are enough ingame that you can delet first.

But yes. This is a problem of course.

 

[Continuum]

Does anyone know what is wrong with my doors?

They become transparent from the front...

I checked exitsting doors and:

fine:

fine:

my doors - not fine:

WTF?

And it's not something related to flags, I guess... Maybe to that damn red hex? But, no I tried different Frames Offset without any results... besides my doors are placed almost exactly in same position like existing ones...



--------------------------------EDIT

And it's not something related to flags, I guess...

Wrong!

Flags --> Wall Light Type --> East/West...

I thought it's only related to walls not to the scenery!


So, nevermind....

--------------------------------EDIT2

I'm proud from my walls/hex template - almost perfectly aligned doorway directly in 3d!