CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Here's a video example of why Fallout 4 drives me nuts.
Ten Reasons Why Fallout 4 is worse than Fallout 3
Carbon Dated and Proud
R.Graves
Confirmed Retard
im not sure about sarah lyons but most of those were added later with DLC when the entire community "Ay what the fuck is this nonsense" when companions who are immune to radiation basically go "nah you should die at 19 because itll make a better story"
Mr Fish
Slippy sloppy, The
This is the same quest AFAIK.
These are all unmarked quests, they're not really "quests" in that sense, more like "tasks".
To be fair, this is a starting point of that quest so it is part of Megaton however the quest can be started elsewhere and it primarily takes place in a completely different location so it isn't really a Megaton quest.
Hardboiled Android
Vault Fossil
I think this is kind of an arbitrary distinction. After all, it was a difference that was introduced by Fallout 3. The unmarked quests in Fallout 3 are just as meaty as plenty of the quests in Fallout 1 and 2, and indeed quite a few marked quests in New Vegas.
It is a unique adventure hook, and moreover it gives you access to a resolution that you're otherwise not guaranteed to be able to access (give Lucy's letter to Ian).
Alphons
National Beholder
Why does everyone always mention fixing pipes for Walter, but never the Holy Water quest from Broken Steel?
TheGM
The voice of reason
ain't nobody gonna remember that shit.
laclongquan
Boned Hunter of Sister
Another, not that we need it, proof that you just didnt play Fallout 3, and keep messing where you shouldnt.
Ghouled Moira, unless you kill her before detonation (dont know why you would do it, but who know), would be outside of the Megaton ruins. Considering she is key NPC to a chain quest, and later moving from Megaton to the bowel of Underworld, it would be a noticeable impact of said detonation.
As for other consequences and reactions, i did mention earlier of Megaton refugees, Three Dogs howling in radio, James reacting, didnt I? That should be major enough for a non-main quest result.
A thousand karma hit is not something you shrug off lightly in Fallout3. You will need a big chunk of play time to earn enough karma to return to neutral, let alone good status.
And as anyone ever play Fallout3 will say, losing Megaton's many merchants and its player house is not something light or insignificant. Tenpenny Tower is in a bloody corner of the map, so either you quick travel like a daily motherfucker, or you will be annoyed by running time (which a lot of immersed RP gamers would be, coming from Morrowind days). There is a reason not alot of gamer would choose to blow up Megaton, and not much of it is due to moral reason.
Norzan
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Apparently i played it more than you and i don't even like this game.
A person moving one location to another is not a consequence. The person literally survives a point-blank explosion so that the player doesn't miss out on a quest.
None of those are major enough, that's the fucking problem. How is someone being disappointed with you after you kill a town of people (this is literally a meme people use as evidence how little consequence there is to blowing up Megaton) a major consequence ? How? Explain to me how. How is an idiot in a radio mentioning it once a major consequence?
And the Megaton refugees make no sense. No one is warned in Megaton about the fact that the town is being destroyed as far as i know, so how there are refugees? Everyone should be dead. The fact that i also never ran into these guys once shows how minor and really meaningless this "consequence" is.
You can literally pay a 1000 caps (which is nothing in this game) to a chuch and get the 1000 lost karma, which is a repeatable quest. Did YOU actually played this game?
Everyone fucking fast travels in these games, Bethesda games are designed with it in mind. So no, this is still not a meaningful consequence, same for losing merchants when you have other places that have those.
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Mr Fish
Slippy sloppy, The
DLC content isn't base game content.
I know it's arbitrary since you can't buy Fallout 3 without the DLC's at this point but it is about what the "intended experience" is from a base game perspective.
I love the Resto Project for Fallout 2 and gladly consider it canon but if I talk about Fallout 2 I will mostly overlook it as it is "additional content" and not base game content part of the original "intended experience".
Hardboiled Android
Vault Fossil
I don't think you actually have to go in to Megaton at any stage of the Holy Water quest.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Yes, Fallout 3 without Broken Steel is a very different game. The DLC is really the "Director's Cut" version and a different experience.
It's actually interesting that if the player manages to convince Mr Burke to double the reward by a speech check or with the Black Widow perk on a female Lone Wanderer, then the player has the exact 1000 caps.
The amount to donate can be minimized due to Godfrey being able to give the player 5 purified waters as soon as the suite is owned (and 5 more every week), then going outside and giving these to the water beggar will increase your karma by a total of 250, so that will reduce the amount we need to donate to the church. Also worth noticing is that we can give 25 caps to Mei (also in Rivet City) for her to buy a weapon and get 100 karma.
So the Lone Wanderer only has to pay 675 caps (25 given to Mei and in 650 donations) and give the initial 5 free purified waters to the water beggar just outside Tenpenny Tower (or even Rivet City since it will go there for the donation). If the Lone Wanderer managed to get 1k caps it will still have 325 caps left from the reward, if it only got 500 caps for blowing Megaton it will have to pay 175 more caps (which shouldn't be hard to have by the time it arrives at Tenpenny Tower).
Of course, none of the above is factoring karma gained by killing raiders or feral ghouls (the LW can just go to the train station near Tenpenny Tower and kill quite a few ferals to get some extra free karma points reducing the donation value even more). Also if the player manages to kill Tenpenny and Mr Burke after exploding Megaton, that will give 200 karma (100 for each), since they both have Very Evil karma.
Norzan
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Even wit all that, no one that blows up Megaton is gonna farm good karma, you blow up Megaton because you want the evil karma. So to claim that needing to farm good karma is a legit consequence is incredibly silly, on top of how ridiculously easy it is to get the karma lost back.
At the end of the day there are no meaningful consequences to blowing up Megaton. At worst you get mild annoyances like your own father being disappointed with you and yet ignores it right after and never mentions it again, or unmarked quests i bet most people didn't even know existed because the majority is only aware of quests due to the quest log, or having to go to Rivet City for merchants.
This quest should have huge reprecussions that affect the entire game in meaningful ways. Can you imagine in New Vegas if you went around killing Legion troops and the only thing that would happen to you was Caesar tell you that he's disappointed with you? That would be ridiculous and it would be memed by the community, but that's what actually happens in Fallout 3.
It's clear that Bethesda was trying to do the whole Killian/Gizmo quest in Junktown from Fallout 1, but forgot to have good writing and things just making sense in general.
At the end of the day there are no meaningful consequences to blowing up Megaton. At worst you get mild annoyances like your own father being disappointed with you and yet ignores it right after and never mentions it again, or unmarked quests i bet most people didn't even know existed because the majority is only aware of quests due to the quest log, or having to go to Rivet City for merchants.
This quest should have huge reprecussions that affect the entire game in meaningful ways. Can you imagine in New Vegas if you went around killing Legion troops and the only thing that would happen to you was Caesar tell you that he's disappointed with you? That would be ridiculous and it would be memed by the community, but that's what actually happens in Fallout 3.
It's clear that Bethesda was trying to do the whole Killian/Gizmo quest in Junktown from Fallout 1, but forgot to have good writing and things just making sense in general.
Hardboiled Android
Vault Fossil
the difference of course being that a "director's cut" is generally a version a creative wanted to make but was unable to realize due to studio/marketing constraints, whereas Broken Steel was driven not by enuine artistic desire but instead market backlash
You chose probably the worst possible example to make your point, even down to "Caesar telling you he's dissapointed with you", but everything is forgiven with the Mark of Caesar.
Hell, I'm pretty sure even if you nuke the Legion prior to meeting Caesar you can still work with him, though granted that's DLC so couldn't have easily been integrated into the base game.
Hardboiled Android
Vault Fossil
This is probably giving them too much credited: While they clearly wanted to copy the vibe of Gizmo vs. Killian with Moriarty vs. Simms, they didn't copy the quest at all.
Indeed, almost nothing in Megaton comes out of human political dynamics that arise from the premises of the setting, instead Megaton's main quest arises out of the mere fact of the bomb's setting, literal set dressing. It would be as though Junktown's main quest were just about the junk.
Norzan
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
That's because you get the Platinum Chip. My point was that Caesar forgiving for you no reason would be silly, with the Platinum Chip there is a reason.
And if you mess with Caesar again, there are no second chances, you get permanently locked out of the Legion questline.
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Alphons
National Beholder
Yes, but the quest is completely unavailable if you blow up Megaton.
Plus you get an alternative ending if you somehow didn't do the Power of Atom and then rig the bomb after getting the quest.
Hardboiled Android
Vault Fossil
Caesar's reaching out to you doesn't have anything to do with the platinum chip - Indeed, Benny can flee to the Fort with the platinum chip and Caesar still sends his Frumentarius to contact the Courier. Same goes if you don't meet Mr. House first, or if you don't talk to Victor first (by coming through the Monorail Station).
The only reason Caesar reaches out to you is because he likes your tenacity in pursuing Benny across the Mojave and your resourcefulness in your travels, he sees you as a potentially useful agent of his aims. It's better written than James' disappointment in their child committing a crime against humanity, but the way the player gets entangled with Caesar is quite flawed and game-y. So is the way the player gets entangled with NCR. Only Mr. House and Yes Man are very "clean" from narrative perspective.
Yeah you are right that it's unavailable, though I wasn't aware of an alternative ending! Do all of the Atomites just die or something?
Alphons
National Beholder
The main lady turns into hostile feral ghoul, while the door guard gets the Moira treatment and stays praying at the ruins.
The BoS guy says that he didn't expect the town to blow up like that, but at least it ended the problem and still gives you full reward.
Gizmojunk
Antediluvian as Feck
Is it? I wondered if triggering Megaton's bomb was the modernized equivalent of taking the water chip; (though not for any altruistic reason, in this case just something to do). It was Pete Hines who mentioned the policy of never writing a quest that would surprise the player—they must always get their expected outcome.
I was always disappointed with them not making the remains of Megaton be an irradiated crater, and physically marred from the overland map; with no option for it to become an alternate resource; just wasted earth. The town never accessible after that.
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