Nuka World should have been its own game

[Vergil]

Dead man's hand?

Did you really expect the bethtard whose made 80+ bethesda apologist posts in a single day to know what the fuck he's talking about? This is the same man(child?) to claim New Vegas is less canon than Tactics.

 

[CerberusGate]

Dead Man's Hand=hated it. Only DLC I did.

Nice job with the wrong name there. Mixing up stimpaks and Med-X before, and now this... Remind me again why I should be following your train of thought again when you easily confuse simple things like this.

Blah Blah Blah.

Don't care; back to Fallout 4 bashing again!

 

[CT Phipps]

Did you really expect the bethtard whose made 80+ bethesda apologist posts in a single day to know what the fuck he's talking about? This is the same man(child?) to claim New Vegas is less canon than Tactics.

New Vegas is part of the Bethesda timeline is my argument. Not that there's a canon or non-canon.

And I got overexcited in my posting.

Mah bad.

 

[CerberusGate]

New Vegas is part of the Bethesda timeline is my argument. Not that there's a canon or non-canon.

And I got overexcited in my posting.

Mah bad.

There is non-canon. Fallout PoS is non-canon to both classic and Bethesda games.

 

[CT Phipps]

But yes, basically I think Raiders are criminally underdeveloped in the Bethesda verse.

I love Raider content and Nuka World was a chance to get some.

Which I heartily approve of.

It's a return of an element of Fallout 2 I enjoyed and disliked being missing from Fallout 2.

What kind of Raiders do you actually mean? Goofy, psychotic people that are irrationally homicidal for no proper reasons or desperate people resorting to horrid methods to survive?

Because I have a feeling you're misunderstanding Fallout 2 completely.

I actually put a 2 there accidentally when I mean the original Khans. But yes, I love Raider culture and the aethstetic in Bethesda but I'd like to see the psychotic punk thing wedded to culture and traditions.

I love the Mad Max style Raiders but want to know why someone becomes like them and what their thing is.

I understand the Enclave and Caesar's Legion for example, even though both are nearly pure evil.

 

[R.Graves]

Fallout is, fundamentally, about being FUN for the sake of fun. It's to nuclear what Dead Rising is to zombies.

The point of the game is to go out dressed like Zombie Abraham Lincoln and murder slavers.

Look dude I'm done insulting you. Frankly that was just me being a dick trying to entertain myself and I have nothing against you.

But I'd like to point out why that is wrong. This may seem a crazy notion but fallout 4 is not fun. To me. Its gameplay is shit and actually worse than NV's apart from some improved animations IMO. (Also roaches on walls is fucking rad but I digress). That's not a compliment to NV's gameplay either, which is also kind shit. In fact they all kinda had shit gameplay. Every. Single. One. Fallout has never had great gameplay IMO. I enjoy the fallout games for the same reasons I enjoy morrowind: the lore, story, and world consistency were top motherfucking notch. Fallout 1&2 had one of the best dialogue systems for an rpg I'd ever seen. 3 & NV dialogue system was a bit of a downgrade IMO but it got the job done. With NV we have the best written dialogue and NPC's in ANY fallout game. Once you take all that away do you know what you're left with? Garbage. And that's my big problem with fallout 4 and by extension nuka world. They took all the positives away and added gimmicks.

 

[CerberusGate]

But yes, basically I think Raiders are criminally underdeveloped in the Bethesda verse.

I love Raider content and Nuka World was a chance to get some.

Which I heartily approve of.

It's a return of an element of Fallout 2 I enjoyed and disliked being missing from Fallout 2.

What kind of Raiders do you actually mean? Goofy, psychotic people that are irrationally homicidal for no proper reasons or desperate people resorting to horrid methods to survive?

Because I have a feeling you're misunderstanding Fallout 2 completely.

 

[CT Phipps]

There is non-canon. Fallout PoS is non-canon to both classic and Bethesda games.

Conceded with gusto.

I generally consider it in my timeline.

"Fallout 1 and 2 happened but the details have been obscured to legend on the West Coast."

"Fallout Tactics didn't happen as in the game but something SIMILAR happened."

"Fallout 3 and NV happened."

"Fallout 4 may have mostly happened but I'm convinced the Sole Survivor is a Synth created by Shaun since DIMAH suggested it. It resolves some of the more glaring plot holes. Certainly, he didn't build a shit ton of settlements himself."

I also headcanon that the East Coast BoS are the Midwestern Brotherhood of Steel's envoys. Not the West Coast's.

 

[CerberusGate]

the details have been obscured to legend on the West Coast

Not quite. The citizenship test for NCR requires you to know who is Tandi, Seth and Aradesh so the first 2 games are history, not legend. The Khans are mentioned to be descendants or linked to the original Khans of 1 and 2 that the player characters wiped out. Events from 2 are recalled by older folk who lived during those times. Ipso facto, history.

But yes, I love Raider culture and the aethstetic in Bethesda but I'd like to see the psychotic punk thing wedded to culture and traditions.

Then Bethesda ought to learn from New Vegas and actually flesh out raiders (like the Fiends whose psychotic nature is directly linked to drugs rather than being homicidal for no apparent reason) rather than copy raiders from 3 and paste them into 4.

I understand the Enclave and Caesar's Legion for example, even though both are nearly pure evil.

Paging @Dr Fallout to argue for the Legion's behalf. They are not pure evil as you claim they are, just barbaric to our modern standards.

 

[Vergil]

I understand the Enclave and Caesar's Legion for example, even though both are nearly pure evil.

What the ave did you just fucking say about The Legion, you little degenerate? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Praetorian Guard, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Hoover Dam, and I have over 300 confirmed NCR dogtags. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I’m the top arena-fighter in the entirety of Caesar's Legion. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over that pip-boy? Think again, dissolute. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of frumentarius across the Mojave Wasteland and your location is being traced right now so you better prepare for the cross, fool. The cross that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, profligate. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of Caesar's Legion and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what Mar's retribution your little “cowardly” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. Degenerates like you belong on a Cross. Ave true to Caesar.

 

[R.Graves]

Ceasar's legion isn't evil. Its a society that thrives on conquest. They aren't doing it just because. What they do is fully necessary for them to function as a society. And it is worth noting that the function much more efficiently than the "good" NCR.

 

[CT Phipps]

View attachment 5623

Look dude I'm done insulting you. Frankly that was just me being a dick trying to entertain myself and I have nothing against you.

But I'd like to point out why that is wrong. This may seem a crazy notion but fallout 4 is not fun. To me. Its gameplay is shit and actually worse than NV's apart from some improved animations IMO. (Also roaches on walls is fucking rad but I digress). That's not a compliment to NV's gameplay either, which is also kind shit. In fact they all kinda had shit gameplay. Every. Single. One. Fallout has never had great gameplay IMO. I enjoy the fallout games for the same reasons I enjoy morrowind: the lore, story, and world consistency were top motherfucking notch. Fallout 1&2 had one of the best dialogue systems for an rpg I'd ever seen. 3 & NV dialogue system was a bit of a downgrade IMO but it got the job done. With NV we have the best written dialogue and NPC's in ANY fallout game. Once you take all that away do you know what you're left with? Garbage. And that's my big problem with fallout 4 and by extension nuka world. They're garbage.

Fallout 4 is an objectively inferior game to Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas. I got 100+ hours of entertainment from it but it was comparable to Dragon Age: Inquisition in that it started with two of my favorite video games of all time and they made it worse. Fallout 4 basically takes what was a perfect formula and they undermined it with settlement, poor voice acting, a removal of entertaining dialogue options, and screwing up the Skills system.

I still had an amazing amount of fun.

But my opinion of Fallout was that it was an inferior sequel which just had a very long way to fall. Nuka World and Far Harbor along with the Companions felt like the few things equal to F3 and NV. That and the BoS--which I wish had been the main villains.

 

[Vergil]

Fallout 4 is an objectively inferior game to Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas.

Fallout: New Vegas is better than either 3 or 4. Stop associating New Vegas with such trash.

 

[CT Phipps]

Ceasar's legion isn't evil. Its a society that thrives on conquest. They aren't doing it just because. What they do is fully necessary for them to function as a society. And it is worth noting that the function much more efficiently than the "good" NCR.

Caesar's Legion is basically the Lord's Liberation Army. It's a religious fueled terrorist organization based around the charisma of a single man playing God while indoctrinating Child Soldiers as well as slave soldiers into the idealogy. It's a very realistic organization but it's entirely a testament to one man's ego. The Khmer Rogue of the Falloutverse versus the Enclave's Nazis.

Honestly, I kind of wish we'd gotten to see it under Lanius as I wondered if it wouldn't be more interesting and ambiguous in its morality.

Then again, I'm with Arcade. "This shit isn't Rome! Rome was cool!"

 

[Vergil]

Caesar's Legion is basically the Lord's Liberation Army. It's a religious fueled terrorist organization based around the charisma of a single man playing God while indoctrinating Child Soldiers as well as slave soldiers into the idealogy. It's a very realistic organization but it's entirely a testament to one man's ego. The Khmer Rogue of the Falloutverse versus the Enclave's Nazis.

Honestly, I kind of wish we'd gotten to see it under Lanius as I wondered if it wouldn't be more interesting and ambiguous in its morality.

Then again, I'm with Arcade. "This shit isn't Rome! Rome was cool!"

I'm starting to wonder whether or not you actually played New Vegas based on some of the retarded shit you're saying.

 

[CT Phipps]

Not quite. The citizenship test for NCR requires you to know who is Tandi, Seth and Aradesh so the first 2 games are history, not legend. The Khans are mentioned to be descendants or linked to the original Khans of 1 and 2 that the player characters wiped out. Events from 2 are recalled by older folk who lived during those times. Ipso facto, history.

Tandi, Seth, and Aradesh can testify to the Vault Dweller's history but it's clearly changed by the time they reached Arryo. Likewise, they can only attest to the events they personally witnessed. A hundred years is a long time and recording of history is hard with no mass communication. They even mention this in Shady Sands with the Vault Dweller's sex obscured in their statue.

Then Bethesda ought to learn from New Vegas and actually flesh out raiders (like the Fiends whose psychotic nature is directly linked to drugs rather than being homicidal for no apparent reason) rather than copy raiders from 3 and paste them into 4.

Which is what I want from Nuka Cola and they started to do. What created the Disciples? The Operators have a nicely fleshed out backstory but you can't talk to them about it. How did the Pack emerge? Are they tribals.

Fallout: New Vegas is better than either 3 or 4. Stop associating New Vegas with such trash.

 

[Vergil]

Seriously, just fuck off back to reddit already.

 

[CT Phipps]

I'm starting to wonder whether or not you actually played New Vegas based on some of the retarded shit you're saying.

Caesar found a bunch of tribals, declared himself their god, and then turned them loose with a fake culture derived from a textbook.

He's a big White Man's Burden character.

But then again, I'm on Team Graham.



And could care less because I'm here to talk about Nuka World.

In any case, Nuka World.

Raiders.

Cool shit.

That would have been an awesome Fallout 4.

Not like the warmed over Boston of Fallout 4.

 

[R.Graves]

I

Ah. This would be the argument of someone with nothing to back up their claim. Look, I too enjoyed fallout 3. But the story is full of plot holes and shit that just makes no sense and because of that it is inferior to NV. I also don't consider fallout 3 canon. Oh and if any DLC should have been a full game then I'd vote either Honest hearts or the Pitt. Honest hearts has more to work with.

 

[CerberusGate]

Caesar's Legion is basically the Lord's Liberation Army. It's a religious fueled terrorist organization based around the charisma of a single man playing God while indoctrinating Child Soldiers as well as slave soldiers into the idealogy. It's a very realistic organization but it's entirely a testament to one man's ego. The Khmer Rogue of the Falloutverse versus the Enclave's Nazis.

Honestly, I kind of wish we'd gotten to see it under Lanius as I wondered if it wouldn't be more interesting and ambiguous in its morality.

...

You've once again missed the forest for the trees. The Legion is another method of creating civilization in a post-apocalyptic world where instead of using modern societal standards and norms, Sallow used an ancient civilization's standards and norms to pacify a region of hostile and savage tribals. The Legion is essentially a newly born nation following practices from ancient civilization. It's not a "religious fueled terrorist organization based around the charisma of a single man playing God ". Something tells me you weren't actually trying to play Fallout New Vegas properly and only took everything at face value.

Whether this is the best method to create civilization is up to debate. Personally, I think it would not be as effective in the West Coast since the society there uses modern societal standards and norms that wind up causing the people there to view the Legion as savage barbarians.

Tandi, Seth, and Aradesh can testify to the Vault Dweller's history but it's clearly changed by the time they reached Arryo. Likewise, they can only attest to the events they personally witnessed. A hundred years is a long time and recording of history is hard with no mass communication. They even mention this in Shady Sands with the Vault Dweller's sex obscured in their statue.

Source of change? Don't make such a statement without proof.
Also, the NCR had proper tech at hand. They could keep historical records of such events even if the Vault Dweller's gender is not remembered (by the way, the canonical gender was male).

Mumbo jumbo

Don't care, 4 is still bad.