Quakecon 2015: Fallout 4 details

[PossibleCabbage]

Yep.

It wasn't different in the classic Fallouts, but at least you had to work for it to be the most important person. (IE: at first you're just a pansy vault dweller, later you become the destroyer of the Master. Like wise for FO2, you're just some no one Tribal and then you destroy the Enclave and save the Wasteland from a dangerous plot.)

Well, a big difference between classic Fallout games and the Elder Scrolls games on which Bethesda built their fame is that the hero of an Elder Scrolls game is generally saving the entire world (this is fairly standard in fantasy games), whereas in Fallout games the most you can possibly accomplish is "making one small corner of the world somewhat less shit."

I think a steady diet of "you are the chosen one" narratives (in 2nd person no less) which don't subvert the whole "chosen one" notion isn't that good for you.

 

[Mohamed2001]

Yep.

It wasn't different in the classic Fallouts, but at least you had to work for it to be the most important person. (IE: at first you're just a pansy vault dweller, later you become the destroyer of the Master. Like wise for FO2, you're just some no one Tribal and then you destroy the Enclave and save the Wasteland from a dangerous plot.)

Well, a big difference between classic Fallout games and the Elder Scrolls games on which Bethesda built their fame is that the hero of an Elder Scrolls game is generally saving the entire world (this is fairly standard in fantasy games), whereas in Fallout games the most you can possibly accomplish is "making one small corner of the world somewhat less shit."

I think a steady diet of "you are the chosen one" narratives (in 2nd person no less) which don't subvert the whole "chosen one" notion isn't that good for you.

Ehh.. I wouldn't really say FO1 is making a small corner less shit. I mean, the Master had a nice argument. Just.. the sterility thing.

For FO2, weren't the Enclave planning to spread the gas over the world, and not only in America?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

For FO2, weren't the Enclave planning to spread the gas over the world, and not only in America?

Pretty much, they wanted to release the modified FEV2 in the air streams above the oil rig and let that carry the virus to the various corners of the world.
I don't get how a water based version would be superior to the air based variant.

 

[Wretched Flamingo]

To who it may concern, regarding the talking Deathclaws or whatever. If you want to be realistic, the only characters (based on the original Fallouts) that makes sense in the east coast that would of derived from the west coast is the Ghoul.

 

[Mohamed2001]

For FO2, weren't the Enclave planning to spread the gas over the world, and not only in America?

Pretty much, they wanted to release the modified FEV2 in the air streams above the oil rig and let that carry the virus to the various corners of the world.
I don't get how a water based version would be superior to the air based variant.

The water based version would be more quick, however only in Washington. And after that -- it's over, it won't expand anymore.

 

[Askorti]

For FO2, weren't the Enclave planning to spread the gas over the world, and not only in America?

Pretty much, they wanted to release the modified FEV2 in the air streams above the oil rig and let that carry the virus to the various corners of the world.
I don't get how a water based version would be superior to the air based variant.

The water based version would be more quick, however only in Washington. And after that -- it's over, it won't expand anymore.

Too bad they intend to dump that FEV close to the mouth of the river instead of the source...

 

[FearMonkey]

Todd Howard provides his stance on pacifist options in Fallout:

Howard won’t elaborate on how that will work, but for players who want to make more love than war, the game will meet them at least halfway. “You can avoid [killing] a lot,” he says. “I can’t tell you that you can play the whole game without violence – that’s not necessarily a goal of ours – but we want to support different play styles as much as we can.”

- source

"That's not necessarily a goal of ours". Of course, because the people who like your games are bloodthirsty savages who just like to blow shit up. Fuck you, Todd.

 

[sesom]

In any case, painfully obvious Beth boy talking out of his ass aside, let's get back to the topic at hand.

Sorry just stoping by (as expected from me) to congratulate you for another successfull Bethesda Fanboy hunt. Hope you will get a lot more trophies on your wall.

 

[Hassknecht]

"[...] we want to support different play styles as much as we can."

What he meant is "[...] we want to support different play styles as much as we want."
Don't lie to us, Todd. You could add non-violent gameplay. But that would mean giving money to writers instead of marketing dudes and explosion-animators.

/edit:

For FO2, weren't the Enclave planning to spread the gas over the world, and not only in America?

Pretty much, they wanted to release the modified FEV2 in the air streams above the oil rig and let that carry the virus to the various corners of the world.
I don't get how a water based version would be superior to the air based variant.

The water based version would be more quick, however only in Washington. And after that -- it's over, it won't expand anymore.

Too bad they intend to dump that FEV close to the mouth of the river instead of the source...

Which also means that the Purifier is extremely useful. For mermaids.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Todd Howard provides his stance on pacifist options in Fallout:

Howard won’t elaborate on how that will work, but for players who want to make more love than war, the game will meet them at least halfway. “You can avoid [killing] a lot,” he says. “I can’t tell you that you can play the whole game without violence – that’s not necessarily a goal of ours – but we want to support different play styles as much as we can.”

- source

"That's not necessarily a goal of ours". Of course, because the people who like your games are bloodthirsty savages who just like to blow shit up. Fuck you, Todd.

He knows his target audience simply to well.



And the funny part is, once you become a Demigod in Skyrim there is really nothing else to do sometimes ... outside of killing townspeople. For no reason.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

And the funny part is, once you become a Demigod in Skyrim there is really nothing else to do sometimes ... outside of killing townspeople. For no reason.

"I'm bored, lets set some villagers on fire." Now players can to find out what it is like to almost be like Kim Jung Un.

 

[FalloutFan85]

"Consolization (not a word) of cRPG's has diluted the genre to where it has gained mass appeal to dudebros, furries, and transexual space robots."

Here we go with this bullshit, has nothing to do with "consolization", it has to do with a lazy developer who caters to lazy gamers who want their hands held.

With that said, every time I read something about Fallout 4, I want to throw up even more.

 

[TorontoReign]

If you actually look at the history behind these developers you can see the jump to consoles diluted the RPG genre. Most of it is where the developers now put their focus, like in Bethesda's case - wasting resources on shitty Pip-Boy games, while only having three voice actors. Save money for things that enhance the game as opposed to more fluff. If they spent the budget they did on Fallout 4 and made a real RPG then we wouldn't be having this problem.

 

[Walpknut]

I have met Bethesda defenders who claim that FO3 and 4 are better than new Vegas because, despite having less content it's a matter of "Wuality vs quantity"...
Then you point out how bad the writting was in 3, how many of the quests where fetch quests and that their defense of 4's approach as more focused and with more quality doesn't work in the face of the Base Building, Pipboy minigames and recording 1000 names for a single NPC to inject awkwardly in dialogue and then they just devolve into insults and claiming you just hate change.

 

[Crni Vuk]

You mean fuck face as name for your child is not a good evolution for RPGs? What are you! An oldtimer? A purits!

Bethesda's got what players crave.

"Consolization (not a word) of cRPG's has diluted the genre to where it has gained mass appeal to dudebros, furries, and transexual space robots."

Here we go with this bullshit, has nothing to do with "consolization", it has to do with a lazy developer who caters to lazy gamers who want their hands held.

With that said, every time I read something about Fallout 4, I want to throw up even more.

It is because of the market and the appeal consoles have. Consoles had always the family-friendly status where the PC was always conected with nerds and adults. Of course the console has its fare share of adult and complex games. It has definitely nothing to do with the specifications of the console. You can make just as awesome games on the console as you can on the PC. But many publishers had the feeling that it was simply easier to sell a console on x-mas compared to a PC. I mean I simply can't really see something like that with PCs.



So in the end, it really all comes down to marketing.

 

[.Pixote.]

People - Don't be affronted by Beths lame excuse for a game...just roll out the originals and play away. For those who feel the reverse, that's OK, F1 and F2 is a special experience that not everyone is in-tune with. Time waits for no man...

 

[Gizmojunk]

People - Don't be affronted by Beths lame excuse for a game...just roll out the originals and play away.

 

[PossibleCabbage]

I think a certain amount of the dumbing down/streamlining of games through consolization just has to do with buttons. A modern video game controller only has 10 buttons usable for input (and R3/L3 are awkward enough that you don't want to use them for much) so you can only ask for as many things to do at once as you can manage with that control setup. Older PC games would use a significant fraction of the keyboard, if you wanted them to.

Like for a specific example, Diablo 2 had 24 user-definable hotkeys for special abilities; Diablo 3 (in part because it was developed with a console port in mind) has only 4. Neverwinter Nights has something like 32 user-definable hotkeys, whereas Dragon Age: Inquisition has 8 (which is actually a step up from it's predecessors) You move from list-based dialogue where up to 10 choices are reasonable (because you can use the number keys to select them) to a dialogue wheel since those are easier to navigate with an analog stick. So when screen space becomes an issue, you run into problems where the whole line of dialogue isn't displayed and you rarely get more than 6 choices.

 

[Crni Vuk]

The question is how many of those keys do you actually need to make your game work? I would guess that with modern technology, layouts and game design you can do almost everything you want with just those 10 buttons. For example a dialogue wheel is not a requirement, even on the old SNES the games which used lists for dialogues worked just fine. And the SNES controller had less buttons than most modern controllers. I find it interesting that there are in particular many old games on the old consoles that required actually quite a lot of brain power from their gamers. And not just with the gameplay - battle toads anyone? But also with story and setting. The old consoles definetly had their awesome games.

It's a difference if I, as gamer designer, try to find ways to utilize those buttons trough clever UI design and gameplay so that my game and my vision works with it or if I simply believe that my target audience is simply to dumb to figure anything of it out so I just go with the lowest denominator - brain dead toddlers with extreme ADHD syndrome and/or asperger's syndrome.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Apologies for rubbing it in Gizmojunk, but I am damn glad I have a big box version of Fallout 1 (and 2) stand in the shelves next to my computer along with Deus Ex 1 and several other gaming classics.
A sad reminder of how much better PC gaming used to be

It is sad but we may have to face the facts that gaming that appealed to our type of crowd is rapidly coming to an end.
I spoke with a friend about it yesterday, he told me it would be better to let go off the past as gaming is never going to be like that again, and either accept games of today or find a new hobby.