Religion is the root of all evil

[Wooz]

I don't find The Bible and evolution mutually exclusive. It depends on how you understand it, and also depends on your definition of God.

In my opinion, the Bible wasn't meant to be interpreted literally, nor to compete with science in analysing the world and providing definitions for it, The Bible's purpose is entirely different. Furthermore, believing in everything that's written in the Bible, word-by-word isn't believing in God. It's worshipping the book itself, making the book your god.

Something the Redemptorists love to do, as well as a lot of die-hard American "Christians".

In any case, the book of Genesis isn't exclusively Christian teaching, it's a part of the Old testament, a text also worshipped by Jews.

You'd do well to read the whole five pages of this thread.

 

[10mmCurator]

I believe the old addage, "An opinion is like an asshole, everyones got one", should come to mind here.

I myself am too jaded to believe that the human race has a God to watch over us.

I however never try to sell anyone on my belief. I was never a fan of shoving my ideas down someone's throat.

People can believe what they want to believe.

 

[Vicious_Squid]

Prepare for another thrashing argument.

The bible is horse shit.

By the way, my Speech skill is relatively high (at least well above average). And I'm not using my Speech skill, I'm typing. Duh.

 

[DirtyDreamDesigner]

Prepare for another thrashing argument.

The bible is horse shit.

By the way, my Speech skill is relatively high (at least well above average). And I'm not using my Speech skill, I'm typing. Duh.

Okay, you get a warning for spamming.

If you want to participate in a thread than you better back your opinion with some arguments, otherwise it's just useless shit.

 

[GatewaysToAnnihilation]

Religion is made up by humans, and therefore humanity is the root of all evil.


Humanity is the root of all good, and the root of all evil.

 

[Bradylama]

Whoa dude, you just like, blew my mind with all that jazz.

Dude. Are you God, dude?

 

[Vicious_Squid]

Whoa dude, you just like, blew my mind with all that jazz.

Dude. Are you God, dude?

What? It's short and to the point. The only way someone of your intelligence could make any sense out of it besides just nodding your head and replying, "uh huh" over and over again while hiding behind your guise.

The bible means nothing, and amounts to nothing, because it's a collection of lies and fantasy. It's so obvious, there's no point in debating it unless the debate itself only concerns content in the Bible, in which case those who were debating it had a common interest in it, so therefore it doesn't matter because if people are arguing about the Bible, then they validate it in the first place. That's all I meant to say but some of you cannot get it through your skull.

 

[Sander]

What? It's short and to the point.

It's also obvious and formulated in a rather....typical fashion, as illustrated by Bradylama.

Oh, wait, you were talking about *your* previous post. What the hell made you think Bradylama was referring to that and not GatewaystoAnnihilation?

The only way someone of your intelligence could make any sense out of it besides just nodding your head and replying, "uh huh" over and over again while hiding behind your guise.

No! Bad Vicious Squid!

The bible means nothing, and amounts to nothing, because it's a collection of lies and fantasy.

Prove it.
Go ahead, prove it.

That's right, *you can't*. And that's because the Bible is a self-calidating concept. Which is why believing in it is called 'faith' and not 'fact'.

It's so obvious, there's no point in debating it unless the debate itself only concerns content in the Bible, in which case those who were debating it had a common interest in it, so therefore it doesn't matter because if people are arguing about the Bible, then they validate it in the first place. That's all I meant to say but some of you cannot get it through your skull.

Strike two for trolling, or just being a moron. Whichever.

What you do not seem to be able to get through your skull is that *saying something is so does not make it so*. We appreciate arguments and logic here, not a statement void of any arguments whatsoever clearly designed to offend people.

You fail to read the thread, including everything that talks about faith, interpretation of the bible and the fact that people *believe* it is true. All you do is come up with a trolling statement 'The bible is horse shit'.
Now, come up with an actual argument or go away.

 

[Vicious_Squid]

Yes, that is correct; the Bible is not fact. People may choose to believe in it, but it is not fact. There's really nothing to explain here... believing is believing.

This thread offended me because I saw it is being utterly pointless and void of any real offering. I'm the one who's offended.

My argument is: there is no interesting point in arguing why people believe in the Bible and other mainstream faith-based inanimate objects which have no consequence besides that which sways people to think irrationally. And also, interpretation of the Bible should be left to those who have already been swayed by its colorful lies.

There's was really nothing at all that was of great interest to me, I was more or less bored to be honest. Sorry, I didn't know you took it so seriously.

I never wished to be offensive, to be honest. I know several individuals who are very close to me who read the Bible, but I do not offend them because I have a real relationship with them and what I've said is simply my own opinion (yeah I know they're like assholes, but that's really what everything argued here amounts to if nothing mentioned involves any facts).

 

[Sander]

Yes, that is correct; the Bible is not fact. People may choose to believe in it, but it is not fact. There's really nothing to explain here... believing is believing.

Yet you skipped entirely by that in your first troll. neat.

This thread offended me because I saw it is being utterly pointless and void of any real offering. I'm the one who's offended.

Not the point. You *intended* to do nothing but troll and offend.

My argument is: there is no interesting point in arguing why people believe in the Bible and other mainstream faith-based inanimate objects which have no consequence besides that which sways people to think irrationally. And also, interpretation of the Bible should be left to those who have already been swayed by its colorful lies.

So, essentially, you post in a thread discussing a subject just to say that that subject isn't worth discussing?
Give me a fucking break. Next time you're going to come in and say 'You all suck for discussing this', don't, okay?

There's was really nothing at all that was of great interest to me, I was more or less bored to be honest. Sorry, I didn't know you took it so seriously.

I never wished to be offensive, to be honest. I know several individuals who are very close to me who read the Bible, but I do not offend them because I have a real relationship with them and what I've said is simply my own opinion (yeah I know they're like assholes, but that's really what everything argued here amounts to if nothing mentioned involves any facts).

No, because people actually use arguments, unlike you. Unless you're pressed for them, apparently.

 

[Paladin Solo]

Yes, that is correct; the Bible is not fact. People may choose to believe in it, but it is not fact. There's really nothing to explain here... believing is believing.

Wait, how is believing in something any different than believing that something is not fact? So your version of the 'truth' is more right than mine? Seriously, you sound like all evangelical fanatics you preach against so recklessly.

This thread offended me because I saw it is being utterly pointless and void of any real offering. I'm the one who's offended.

No one forced you to click on this thread. You entered it of your own free will. Also, consider that your posts to some people are seen as being "utterly pointless and void of any real offering" especially since you just preach "the bible is horse shit" and "it's a collection of lies and fantasy." Congratulations, you just offered more "utterly pointless and void of any real offering" nonsense to more of what you claim to be "utterly pointless and void of any real offering" nonsense. So you just offended yourself?

My argument is: there is no interesting point in arguing why people believe in the Bible

Then why are you in this thread? Why not just avoid it? What do you care what people believe? Or are you the same as those door-to-door "my religion/absence of it or the highway" people who try to force their beliefs on others?

and other mainstream faith-based inanimate objects

I love how people say "mainstream" for everything they disagree with. You little rebel you.

which have no consequence besides that which sways people to think irrationally.

People on both sides think irrationally, like yourself.

And also, interpretation of the Bible should be left to those who have already been swayed by its colorful lies.

People interpret things differently. Calling something you disagree with "colorful lies" makes you look just as much full of shit as those who fanatically force their religion on populations.

There's was really nothing at all that was of great interest to me, I was more or less bored to be honest. Sorry, I didn't know you took it so seriously.

Wow. I seriously did not think you could deprive your 'argument' of any kind of basis anymore than you already have, but once again, you surprise me.

I never wished to be offensive, to be honest.

Oh really?

The bible is horse shit.

What? It's short and to the point. The only way someone of your intelligence could make any sense out of it besides just nodding your head and replying, "uh huh" over and over again while hiding behind your guise.

which have no consequence besides that which sways people to think irrationally.

And also, interpretation of the Bible should be left to those who have already been swayed by its colorful lies.

...

I know several individuals who are very close to me who read the Bible, but I do not offend them because I have a real relationship with them and what I've said is simply my own opinion (yeah I know they're like assholes, but that's really what everything argued here amounts to if nothing mentioned involves any facts).

There is a difference between educated opinion and baseless trolling.

Edit:

Damn it, Sander, you post too soon!

 

[FeelTheRads]

It is in essence a scientific tool you wish to apply to a set of beliefs based on faith? Seems silly to me.

A couple of pages back either Sander or Kharn said something similar. That logic or science shouldn't be applied to god.
Well, then isn't it actually silly to believe in something on which you can't apply logic?
For what reason should I even accept the possibility of a god if it's something that defies logic?
Isn't is silly to say that I can't deny the existence of a god based on logic because logic doesn't apply in this case?

We, the human race, are so inferior to the Universe that we are unable to grasp it in it's entirety.

Blah, blah, blah.
God is beyond our understanding, we are stupid and can't comprehend what he does and what he is.
It's the same crap thinking like yours. Go on living in your inferior world, while people out there actually find a lot more about the universe than you have idea of.

I'm a realist. A realist would realize there is no possible way to know. Thats why I choose agnosticism.

No. You choose agnosticism because you don't want to know. You want to go through life whistling claiming there is no reason to bother with it.
Well, then, couple that with the realist you claim to be and you should realize there is no reason to bother with anything at all. And yet, people bother with many things.

*I would agree, though, with someone who said that there is no reason to bother with the existence of god, because it should be denied from the start. That's where the pointlessness is... to ponder the existence of god, while that time could be used to find how the universe and everything came to be.

You're not a realist, you're not an agnostic. If you really want to label yourself, label yourself as an ignostic, that's more close to what you say.
I would label you as just another "I found the magic ball and I know better than everybody" person, though.

Scientific proofs are based on theories. Theories are not facts, but guesses based on repeated observations, testing, and measurements.

I hope you mean that proofs result from theories and observations, testing and measurements, because otherwise I'd be inclined to label you as an idiot.


*Edited in.

 

[Sander]

A couple of pages back either Sander or Kharn said something similar. That logic or science shouldn't be applied to god.
Well, then isn't it actually silly to believe in something on which you can't apply logic?
For what reason should I even accept the possibility of a god if it's something that defies logic?
Isn't is silly to say that I can't deny the existence of a god based on logic because logic doesn't apply in this case?

It's self-evident, and that's the entire *point* of faith. It's not supposed to be based on logic. Otherwise it wouldn't be called faith.

This is an essential difference in philosophy. You judge everything by logic, there are people who apply faith.

No. You choose agnosticism because you don't want to know. You want to go through life whistling claiming there is no reason to bother with it.
Well, then, couple that with the realist you claim to be and you should realize there is no reason to bother with anything at all. And yet, people bother with many things.

Ooh, nice, ad hominems.
Now try an *argument*.

By the way, here's logic and *scientific reasoning* for you: it is impossible to disprove the existence of God. So you don't bother with it, there's no point to it whatsoever.

*I would agree, though, with someone who said that there is no reason to bother with the existence of god, because it should be denied from the start. That's where the pointlessness is... to ponder the existence of god, while that time could be used to find how the universe and everything came to be.

And there are people who, gosh, don't wish to bother with that.
By the way, why are you wasting your time debating something you feel is unworthy of thought?

You're not a realist, you're not an agnostic. If you really want to label yourself, label yourself as an ignostic, that's more close to what you say.
I would label you as just another "I found the magic ball and I know better than everybody" person, though.

I'm going to label you as an arrogant dick, now. *Think* for fuck's sake.

 

[Brother None]

Well, then isn't it actually silly to believe in something on which you can't apply logic?

Really now? Because "applying logic" is the only measure of truth? Please tell me how logic is some kind of read-all measuring stick with which everything and anything can be defined and measured.

 

[FeelTheRads]

You judge everything by logic, there are people who apply faith.

But is it about the truth for some or the truth for all?
It doesn't matter what is true for some.
If some people apply faith, it doesn't mean is should be considered as a possible truth.

I apply logic... because, besides the concept of god (and all the branching that stems from it), is there anything else that defies logic?

So, that answers Kharn's question too.

By the way, why are you wasting your time debating something you feel is unworthy of thought?

I'm actually debating why should the existence of god even be considered.

 

[Sander]

But is it about the truth for some or the truth for all?
It doesn't matter what is true for some.
If some people apply faith, it doesn't mean is should be considered as a possible truth.

And why not?

I apply logic... because, besides the concept of god (and all the branching that stems from it), is there anything else that defies logic?

Logic is a self-proving concept, and hence just as much a faith as God. Though logic has shown us a lot of supporting evidence.

I'm actually debating why should the existence of god even be considered.

Er, no you aren't, you're just flat-out telling people it shouldn't be considered. That's not debating anything.

By the way, here's another neat thought: suppose that there is a good (which is entirely possible), then your denial that such a being exist actually lands you automatically farther from truth.

 

[Brother None]

I apply logic... because, besides the concept of god (and all the branching that stems from it), is there anything else that defies logic?

I am missing a step here. You're saying that once you're inside the logic paradigm logic can be used to prove and explain everything. This is also true of religion. So with both, I'm missing a step: why believe in them in the first place?

 

[Vicious_Squid]

Wait, how is believing in something any different than believing that something is not fact? So your version of the 'truth' is more right than mine? Seriously, you sound like all evangelical fanatics you preach against so recklessly.

No, I don't BELIEVE (assume) it is no fact. I know it's not fact.

Okay, how do I sound like all evangelical fanatics I *disagree* with (I disagree based on what THEY choose to believe, not what I KNOW). That's the point, don't you get it? Belief is belief.

I don't have a *version* of the truth. The truth is the truth. I choose not to distort it or have a different version, I didn't talk about any "truths". This isn't philosophy. It's common sense, which you don't seem to grasp that well. I ASSUME that you merely go against what I am saying, either based on your own beliefs and "truths", or based on the fact that everyone else is going against what I'm saying because of my failure to produce a credible argument in your eyes.

Congratulations, you just offered more "utterly pointless and void of any real offering" nonsense to more of what you claim to be "utterly pointless and void of any real offering" nonsense. So you just offended yourself?

No.

Congratulations, you added to that void as well.

Just because I said that doesn't mean anything else has a point. There's no reason why I should even entertain myself in the first place, I don't need to in order to survive.

Then why are you in this thread? Why not just avoid it? What do you care what people believe? Or are you the same as those door-to-door "my religion/absence of it or the highway" people who try to force their beliefs on others?

I don't care what people believe, I did not say that.

I chose NOT to avoid it because I knew it would entertain me.

I'm sorry... did I say I was affiliated, or I identify with, some religion or *belief* system? No... I stated nothing on my behalf, of any spiritual beliefs or notions. And no, I did not say that what I say is the only way.

I love how people say "mainstream" for everything they disagree with. You little rebel you.

No, I do not refer to anything I disagree with as mainstream. I meant mainstream as in, MAINSTREAM. And no, I do not consider myself a rebel.

People on both sides think irrationally, like yourself.

Of course I think irrationally, the same as any other human being (as do you).

People interpret things differently. Calling something you disagree with "colorful lies" makes you look just as much full of shit as those who fanatically force their religion on populations.

..Not really. I disagree with it because I know it is not based on fact. People "who fanatically force their religion on populations" do not acknowledge fact, they acknowledge belief.

Wow. I seriously did not think you could deprive your 'argument' of any kind of basis anymore than you already have, but once again, you surprise me.

Well, I'm sure you (and everyone else) is here a lot because you're bored. I was simply being honest. It is entertaining, and I *assume* that is the sole reason why mostly everyone else is here. To entertain themselves... although this does involve, on an indirect level, of stimulating economic growth.

Oh really?

Yes, really.

...

Please say something other than "...".

There is a difference between educated opinion and baseless trolling.

I know. "..." is baseless.

 

[Vicious_Squid]

By the way, here's another neat thought: suppose that there is a good (which is entirely possible), then your denial that such a being exist actually lands you automatically farther from truth.

Sure, it *could* exist. But why, and how? Because people say it/he/she exists?

Which leads into a spiraling and endless back-and-forth argument, usually the one that says it does not, uses fact, the one that says it does, uses assumptions. It cannot be proven or disproven, therefore there's no point in trying to argue it (beyond the spectrum of religiously-minded thinking, in which case it would be a different argument).

 

[Dracon M'Alkir]

Religion *

+ To inspire hope.
+ To give humanity morals.
+ To make death more tolerable.
+ To make war acceptable.
+ To make funds when required.
+ To take control of governing bodies when required.

+ To uphold the human moral code of law, the system of order that has been spread so rapidly and so throughly that it will forever grip those under the influence. The fear of an invisible deity ensures that these morals are never broken, and that follows will turn unbelievers into believers. It's like a virus. Spreads quickly, and very hard to get rid of.

BUT, without religion there would be more chaos than there already is. It's a necessary evil.

As a final judgement : I believe that it is not our place, nor in our best interests to tell others in what they should believe in. If they like religion, let them have religion. If they don't like religion, let them have atheism. As long as everyone is happy, nothing truly matters.