Ben Soto
Professional Salt Shaker
Not the karma system. The reputation system, yes, but not karma. If there's one thing I'm glad F4 cut off, it's karma.
Preston Garvey, arguable the most annoying Fallout character ever, spawns dozens of related memes
- Thread starter Korin
- Start date
They could have at least tried karma. I wanted the fact that I beat an old woman and her punk ass teenage son to death with a baseball bat to have some kind of impact on the rest of my game. At least in Fallout 3 you could side with some raiders and get up to some evil shenanigans.
If we had a system similar to FNV, I'd say that would be best. Reputations are much needed in F4, because my actions only matter if I'm with a companion with the whole companion affinity system that I couldn't really care about.
vdweller84
First time out of the vault
Irwin John Finster
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
That seems like less of a "missed opportunity" and more like a *deliberate design choice* by Bethesda. They clearly didn't want to make a great story and immersive RPG, they wanted to make a Borderlands clone with "Legendary ________" enemies whose names don't really matter. There is no difference between raider or mirelurk in the game. It's all just fodder for you to BLAM BLAM BLAM with your Enchanted Flamer of Freezing because that's what the kids want these days - an offline MMO grindfest with as little reading or immersion as possible.
There's a lot of people who don't know what RPGs are saying things like "I don't usually like RPGs but I LOVE Fallout 4!" and it just makes me cringe.
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MercenarySnake
Kept you waiting huh?
Well if RPGs didn't have good characters, didn't have world building with a sense of progression, have in-depth dialogue and dialogue choices, C&C, good hand crafted quests, added handholding with things like quest markers, created places that existed just for the sole purpose of being a dungeon shooting gallery, and no actual cities/towns then I'm sure Fallout 4 would fit right in.
ZigzagPX4
The Swiftness of the Ranger
Wouldn't it make you satisfied? It confirms that Fallout 4 is nothing like an RPG, which is true. The fact that in comparison people who hate RPGs like Fallout 4 is kind of a red flag that Fallout 4 isn't one.
On another note, I'm happy with discussing what Fallout 4 ripped off and failed to work with, but Borderlands as a game on its own, lets not bash it. It has its own merits - plenty of people (including me) enjoy having loot-shooter action-RPGs accelerated mostly by similar gameplay repetitively. It has its own charms. Plus, that kind of thing works well with co-op - that's why you see Destiny also being multiplayer. Repetition isn't the spawn of the devil, it's simply a technique that can work well if used with the right games in the right pace.
Fallout 4 worked off the, again, multiplayer game design school but doesn't actually have the multiplayer.
Irwin John Finster
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Not "bashing" Borderlands. I personally don't like it, as it's boring (more like BORED-erlands am I right??) but it's fine for what it is. I had hoped it would be an actual RPG instead of the mindless repetitive co-op fest it is. But whatever, it's a new series so it didn't ruin anything.
Fallout 4 trying to be Borderlands is where the wheels start coming off. That is just inexcusable. It's basically a singleplayer Borderlands where all the missions boil down to "Go here, kill this, loot crates" which is pretty much Borderlands in a nutshell. Yahtzee even spent time pointing this out.
If I wanted to play Borderlands or Far Cry 3 I would just go play those games. I didn't need or want another mindless repetitive grindfest or a straight up action shooter. I expected a Fallout game that was at least on the same level as Fallout 3 and instead I got an offline MMO grindfest. If they removed the dialogue wheel and just had the dialogues play out without your input, there would be zero change in how FO4 plays out.
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ZigzagPX4
The Swiftness of the Ranger
Ah, someone else is also a fan of Yahtzee's wit. Nice. Still, Borderlands seems like wasted potential, but after playing through Telltale's Tales from the Borderlands, it really feels like people are seeing too much into it. Borderlands is humour, pop-culture references and a touch of satire, but there's not much more in the writing that's really unique enough to be built on. There's plenty of "actual RPGs" around already, I like it there for what it is. Granted, I can think of a couple of ways to significantly improve it, but nevermind that.
The real point is that, I do agree. It's boiling a once-complex game down and then throwing "what the kids like" into the mix, just for the sales. A ridiculous waste of potential.
And really, on the mention of Yahtzee, I actually assume he started with Fallout 3 and has barely heard of the original two, since he was quite positive with the Fallout 3 recommendation. But if he had the time to look into it, he would see that Bethesda did the same to Fallout what EA and Square Enix did to Syndicate and Thief respectively, and that would probably set off an entire video from him, since it's one of his pet peeves.
Basically, when someone who disapproves of streamlining games and "turning the brain off to enjoy entertainment" started with Fallout 3 says the game has dumbed down since, then that's a MASSIVE sign, that something went wrong in the process. Seriously, if it's dumbed down in comparison to FO3 alone then I imagine it's not even on the same spectrum as the original two.
Sn1p3r187
Carolinian Shaolin Monk
Only if you refuse to help them in Concord or never go to Sanctuary again. Stay near him for too long and he'll just give you a radiant quest. No actual option to refuse anything. If you finish a radiant quest you have to immediately run away from him or you'll just get a new quest.
And the next time you talk to someone in Sanctuary and he walks by... "There's another settlement that needs your help! I'll mark it on your map."
yea. so? you can decide to not do the radiant quest. ignore it. you guys know it, right?
It's still extremely annoying that, as soon as that radiant quest runs out of time and fails, you get a new one as soon as you get near him. The fact that you can ignore him doesn't make Pesto Gravy any less annoying. It also doesn't make the design choice to not enable the player to tell Pesto to bugger off with his damn radiant quests any less terrible.
In Skyrim you had to actively seek out the radiant quests. You had at least the choice to clutter your journal with boring shit. You don't even get that much in Fallout 4.
Terrible times indeed when Skyrim is used as a good example...
well, you can actually tell him to fuck off. right in the beggining when he asks you to be general. you can say no or maybe, and both will leave minutemen quest closed. you guys even played the game? from all things i saw on this site, seems like you are full of hate towards anything from bethesda.
Spacemunkey
Vault Senior Citizen
I'd say a game where you have to ignore 1/4 of the content right off the bat because the devs can't be bothered to write a proper quest line for one of it's major factions to be more than simple "Bethesda hate."
well its title marketed for wider audience, not really intelectually challenging game. but that was known from the start. its AAA for the masses. and masses dont want intelectuall challenges. but decision with what faction to side with is hard one. spent 2 days on thinking about it. also, minutemen were to simulate building up of faction from the start, and it actually implemented it very well. repetitive tasks, taking care of people unable to defend themselfs, aka dealing with irresponsible assholes. just like in real life, feel the frustration.
Spacemunkey
Vault Senior Citizen
How is it implemented well? As the "general" of the MM you are tasked with rescuing every settler in distress with no option of delegating the task to your subordinates, no chance to retake Quincy, and I'm sorry but 2 people living in a crater is not a settlement. Just because something is expected to be dumbed down for the excuse of reaching a wider audience doesn't mean it shouldn't be criticized for it.
well, it represent tediousness of the tasks you have to do. aka everything. simulates frustration very well.
Let's not pretend like being tedious and annoying was an intentional design decision.
Yes, I played the game... that's how I know Preston is an annoying ass rancher. The first time I played I said, "Yes" and became Minute-Man-Married to the cunt for the whole playthrough. That's how most people figured it out. No backsies. He's also required to unlock settlements if you want to use them.