naossano
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
You ought to give enough context if you want a conflit to be the central plot point.
Redeeming qualities of the Enclave?
- Thread starter Mutant Screg
- Start date
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Context in a "nu" Fallout game? Never!
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Honestly, I think the Enclave is a much more compelling villain than the Master. They are, after all, still human and have a point other than to destroy humanity by turning them into monsters.
Black Angel
Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus
Context? In BGS's games? What's that?
a721402
Perhaps tomorrow will be better.
It never existed unless you create it in your head.
Prone Squanderer
A bit of a Sillius Soddus.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I'm a die-hard Raider fan. I love them like some other posters love the Enclave or Caesar's Legion.
WHY IS THERE NO OPTION TO SIDE WITH THE RAIDERS IN NEW VEGAS!?
WHY IS THERE NO OPTION TO SIDE WITH THE RAIDERS IN NEW VEGAS!?
YeeCop
Just a Sweet Irradiated Transvestite
Think about it like this: everybody in the CW tries to buy purified water if they can, over irradiated water. If you can afford to live in Megaton/Rivet City/Canterbury Commons, you can probably afford to buy purified water. James' mission was to mass purify all the irradiated water so no one would have spend extra on purified water anymore. At least that's how I see it.
The problem with that is that no vendor in the entire game sells purified water. Even the Doctor in Tenpenny Tower (which have pure water coming out of it's taps) only sells Dirty Water. So purified water is not for sale in the Capital Wasteland.
Also the value of purified water is the same as a Nuka-Cola or two dirty water bottles, so if it was for sale it is not that expensive to begin with.
Prone Squanderer
A bit of a Sillius Soddus.
Yet you'd think that if purified water is so rare, someone would take advantage and sell it, creating some measure of power for themselves like the Water Merchants in Fallout 1.
Jogre
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
You find a group who are so terrified of mutants interbreeding with "pure humans" that they want to wipe out the vast majority of the wasteland's population more compelling than a guy who simply wants to make people more fit to survive in the wasteland and unite people under a common cause?
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
The Master is a psychic cyborg flesh-monster who wants to dip people in ooze and enslave them with his powers. He's a cartoonish villain who has no relevance in the real world or social critique value. He's good at his job but I've never felt his story added anything to the actual setting but an antagonist and a sign the writers were great at providing multiple endings.
The Enclave, by contrast, offer real-world social critique on the United States and factionalism as well as prejudice--however blunt and direct it is. Certainly, I think the Enclave's plan is more feasible than the Master's and has more dignity than the horror show of making giant orcs out of mankind or keeping us in camps until we die.
I know I'm in the minority on this but I prefer my villains to be humans who have real motivations and goals. Caesar, The Enclave, the gangs of New Reno, and so on all over the Master.
Re: Water
Everyone is drinking slightly irradiated water, which means everyone is taking radiation damage slowly and it's killing almost everyone just little by little. This lore rather than a gameplay mechanic. Purified water doesn't kill people little by little. It's not rocket science that it's better than the alternative (Dirty Water).
And yet we have people who are really old and always consumed dirty water all their lives.
If the water in the Capital Wasteland was killing people little by little with each drink no one would live until 20 years old.
A bottle of dirty water gives +5 rads, humans die at 1000 rads so a human would die after consuming 200 bottles of water, if one human would need a bottle per day, the human would die in 200 days or less than 1 year... Having a small sip of water from any tap, water tower, fire hydrant gives +2 rads, so one would need to only sip 500 times from those water sources to die.
Let's face it, the Capital Wasteland water problem is not shown at all during the entire game. I assume the only thing purified water would bring to the CW is allowing people to farm, but even food doesn't seem to be a problem in the CW because no one complains of hunger and we don't see anyone dying from lack of food.
Only times people complain about water is the water beggars (and yet some are really old people already with white hair, beards and wrinkles everywhere in their face) and Ben Canning, but that one happily accepts dirty water (the game even prioritizes giving him dirty water).
What is even more stupid is that if anyone scavenged a bit in DC, they would find a lot of purified water bottles.
Also to be honest, Mr Handy robots can get purified water right out of the air (condensation collectors), 5 bottles per week.
If purified water was such a necessity, why won't the Capital Wasteland "settlers" create condensation collectors in their houses or settlements and have free pure water (in the Mad Max game the player can find condensation collectors in most places where people live, even if it is just a broken down boat in the middle of the desert with only 3 raiders living in it, and the player can drink/fill his canteen from them and they refill over time because they are collecting condensation).
Last edited:
ThatZenoGuy
Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism
IIRC the effects of rads are lethal WAY before 1000.
Its just that 1000 is basically 'you ded no matter what'.
Its just that 1000 is basically 'you ded no matter what'.
YeeCop
Just a Sweet Irradiated Transvestite
Nah, The Master is probably the best villain in the whole Fallout series. The Enclave's endeavors I found pretty predictable, albeit terrifying, because that's already the same kind of stuff the U.S. government conducts on a daily basis behind closed doors. *X-Files theme plays*
The Enclave are politicians, scientists, generals, soldiers, and grunts. They only follow the old American creed, although not everyone is loyal to it as evidenced by Dr. Henry and Ron Meyers' departure. The Enclave are at best a beefy, powerful, everyday faction like the gangs in New Reno (with energy weapons and Frank Horrigan)
The Master and his mutant armies? It's terrifying... EVERYONE has undying, fervent religious obedience and loyalty for the Master and the Cathedral's teachings (at least the humans do). Children of the Cathedral members even committed suicide in the Den when the Master died!! The fact that you can manipulate hundreds or thousands of people through religious indoctrination and dipping them into vats for a "mutant peace" makes him the biggest villain of the whole series. I don't think any faction has been as petrifying as the /master and his army.
Jogre
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Cobra Commander
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
The Bethesda's writers should have read Dune before writing about the lack of water problem in Fallout 3. In this book this issue is covered ALL THE TIME!!!!
Side note: Elijah is my favorite fallout's villain. How crazy and dangerous this old man are.
Side note: Elijah is my favorite fallout's villain. How crazy and dangerous this old man are.
YeeCop
Just a Sweet Irradiated Transvestite
"Do you wish to join the Unity, or do you wish to die? Join!! Die!!"
There's a difference between the acute and chronic effects of radiation. Acute effects are basically radiation sickness. Direct damage to your tissues and organs, faster than the body can repair them. Take a lot of radiation in one go, and it will kill you.
Chronic effects are a random process. Even if the damage to your tissues is small enough to be repaired by your body, there is still the chance that the radiation has damaged your DNA. Damaged DNA mainly manifests itself as an increase cancer risk. A dose of 5Sv of radiation will kill you if you take it all on one go. If you take it in gradually, it will still damage your DNA, but it won't kill you directly. 5Sv taken gradually will increase your risk of cancer by about 25% (or about a quarter the risk of smoking a pack of cigarettes a day), but if you're lucky, it won't damage anything important.
You see really old smokers, you would also see really old people who have taken a big dose of radiation. They're just the ones lucky enough to have dodged the cancer bullet.
Of course, with the water issue, the game glosses over the fact that it's actually really easy to purify water. Almost all the radiation 200 years after a nuclear detonation will come from long-lived Caesium isotopes (no relation to the Legion!). Caesium is highly reactive and will almost always form salts, which you can get rid of by simply distilling the water. It also means that rainwater will be pretty much free of radiation by the time of the game.
Cobra Commander
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
Speaking of which, I never understood the point of setting the game 200 years later. This too much time, too much
. It may seem extremely nitpicking on my part, but I know what the reason was. 200 years (exactly) after the great war sounds cooler than ... I don't know, 70 years. Why did not they do a few years after F2 if they wanted to use Enclave and Harold so much?
. It may seem extremely nitpicking on my part, but I know what the reason was. 200 years (exactly) after the great war sounds cooler than ... I don't know, 70 years. Why did not they do a few years after F2 if they wanted to use Enclave and Harold so much?