The Outer Worlds - Early Impressions

[Chud]

Yeah, Young Blood was a flop, and Rage 2 did so-so business.

As for Bethesda's future games, there's been speculation and rumors that Starfield, their so-called sci-fi RPG, is in development hell. If they're using the same broken engine and forcing it to do even more than it's capable of, I won't be surprised if these rumors are true. Add in the likelihood of loot crates/micro-transcriptions/subscription fees and a bland gameworld like Fallout 4, and we're looking at a total train-wreck in the making.

As for Bethesda's diminishing quality people for a few years now have pointed to it beginning with Fallout 3 leading to Skyrim then to Fallout 4 and finally to Fallout 76. Dumbing down of story and content in Fallout 3; bland repetition, a big boring map and making a god character in Skyrim; removal of essential RPG mechanics [Good narrative, skill points, choices) in Fallout 4; and finally an even bigger map filled with boring combat and broken shit to play with "friends" in Fallout 76.

The Outer Worlds isn't a perfect game, it does have some flaws, but players can look past those flaws to its strengths. The combat isn't what makes an RPG. Tabletop combat is all done with pencils, dice and vivid imaginations. Obsidian gets that, while Bethesda has forgotten.

 

[Korin]

There have been rumours that manpower from Maryland was actually used to fix the mess that was Fallout 76

If anything it was the other way around, the Dallas studio was brought in early on to handle a majority of the fixes and were doing most of the ongoing work. The Austin studio was doing most of the work initially. Bethesda main studios involvement was more of the high level stuff like art direction.

 

[RangerBoo]

As for Bethesda's future games, there's been speculation and rumors that Starfield, their so-called sci-fi RPG, is in development hell. If they're using the same broken engine and forcing it to do even more than it's capable of, I won't be surprised if these rumors are true. Add in the likelihood of loot crates/micro-transcriptions/subscription fees and a bland gameworld like Fallout 4, and we're looking at a total train-wreck in the making.

This is what leads me to believe that Bethesda will release a trailer for Elder Scrolls 6 next E3. Fans are pissed and their fanbase is dwindling. The most surefire way to bring back fans is to tease Elder Scrolls 6. Nobody gives a shit about Starfield but an Elder Scrolls game is what most fans have been asking for. They release a trailer with a release date and many of those fans that have been critical will give Bethesda a second chance.

 

[Chud]

The fanbase may give them a second chance, but if it's anything less than stellar (From their point of view) it's going to get uglier. There's no way the next Elder Scrolls doesn't have micro-transactions and other related BS.

 

[CT Phipps]

Yeah, Young Blood was a flop, and Rage 2 did so-so business.

As for Bethesda's future games, there's been speculation and rumors that Starfield, their so-called sci-fi RPG, is in development hell. If they're using the same broken engine and forcing it to do even more than it's capable of, I won't be surprised if these rumors are true. Add in the likelihood of loot crates/micro-transcriptions/subscription fees and a bland gameworld like Fallout 4, and we're looking at a total train-wreck in the making.

As for Bethesda's diminishing quality people for a few years now have pointed to it beginning with Fallout 3 leading to Skyrim then to Fallout 4 and finally to Fallout 76. Dumbing down of story and content in Fallout 3; bland repetition, a big boring map and making a god character in Skyrim; removal of essential RPG mechanics [Good narrative, skill points, choices) in Fallout 4; and finally an even bigger map filled with boring combat and broken shit to play with "friends" in Fallout 76.

The Outer Worlds isn't a perfect game, it does have some flaws, but players can look past those flaws to its strengths. The combat isn't what makes an RPG. Tabletop combat is all done with pencils, dice and vivid imaginations. Obsidian gets that, while Bethesda has forgotten.

Skyrim and Fallout 3 were some of their most beloved and widely-loved games. In a way, there's definitely some people talking past one another. On these boards, in particular, you can't have a discussion because everyone is outraged by Fallout 76 but for some people it's because it's a complete betrayal of all that was awesome abouit Fallout 3 and much worse than Fallout 4.

While other people are like, "Fallout 3 was awful and so was Skyrim. I don't see the difference."

Which leads to no conversation.

This is what leads me to believe that Bethesda will release a trailer for Elder Scrolls 6 next E3. Fans are pissed and their fanbase is dwindling. The most surefire way to bring back fans is to tease Elder Scrolls 6. Nobody gives a shit about Starfield but an Elder Scrolls game is what most fans have been asking for. They release a trailer with a release date and many of those fans that have been critical will give Bethesda a second chance.

It depends what the game is like. If Bethesda's work was all built on the assumptions of Fallout 76 being what people wanted then they may have a serious problem. They still haven't gotten NPCs into the game yet and that was what people wanted most. I mean, fucking Destiny has NPCs.

 

[RangerBoo]

I have since come to the conclusion that Fallout 76 was the same flaws as Fallout 4. They de-emphasized story for combat and then assumed that people really just wanted the combat (why?) and atmosphere (no). So all the flaws of F4 were ramped up to the 11.

In any case, I gave them a lot of slack and genuinely love Skyrim and Fallout 3 but Bethesda squandered all of the considerable good will I had for them.

My suspicion is also they planned to do the same for Elder Scrolls and Starfield, which means that they probably have a bunch of games exactly the same as ones people hated.

The problem with Bethesda games is, as one of my favorite YouTubers LegacyKillaHD has said, that Bethesda streamlines their games more and more with each installment. Fallout 3 and Oblivion were flawed, sure, but there was still some RPG elements in those games. When developing Skyrim, Bethesda striped many RPG elements out of that game due to wanting to gain a more casual audience. It worked and Skyrim is one of the best selling games ever made. Bethesda thinks they can keep doing the same formula as Skyrim, however I think gamers are craving a more meaningful experience with games now. At least for those who play RPG's.
Yet Bethesda has never been one for originality. Fortnite is popular and making millions of dollars (God help us.). Bethesda wants that Fortnite kiddie crowd even though the Fortnite crowd are mostly 12 year olds who aren't interested in Bethesda games. Bethesda is still going to pander to them hard. When even EA is streamlining their games less and are actually allowing their highly anticipated Star Wars game to release on Steam you know you have fucked up in the eyes of gamers.

 

[CT Phipps]

The thing is that I suspect the backlash is something they really did not actually expect. Which is fine, if that would only affect Fallout 76 (as bad as that was). The thing is, that it's very likely they had their "streamlining" planned for their other games and with the years in development, they may have games that they're only now realizing won't sell.

And what to do about that.

There's also an irony that as "streamlined" as Skyrim is, it's got huge numbers of plots, lore, and world-building.

 

[RangerBoo]

The thing is that I suspect the backlash is something they really did not actually expect. Which is fine, if that would only affect Fallout 76 (as bad as that was). The thing is, that it's very likely they had their "streamlining" planned for their other games and with the years in development, they may have games that they're only now realizing won't sell.

And what to do about that.

There's also an irony that as "streamlined" as Skyrim is, it's got huge numbers of plots, lore, and world-building.

The problem with Skyrim is that there were really good ideas and lore in the game that wasn't explored upon or felt half finished. Which is a damn shame as I enjoy a heavily modded Skyrim. I get the feeling that Skyrim was rushed during development and/or Zenimax told Bethesda that exploring the lore and world building like in Morrowind would turn casual players off. The Elder Scrolls has very interesting but very weird and far out lore and mythology. Your average 12 year old Fortnite player or Twitch Streamer, if playing a Skyrim that was similar to Morrowind in terms of lore and world building, would have stared dead eyed at the screen saying; "This is stupid! It makes my head hurt! I want to go back to killing dragons!"

 

[CerberusGate]

Your average 12 year old Fortnite player or Twitch Streamer, if playing a Skyrim that was similar to Morrowind in terms of lore and world building, would have stared dead eyed at the screen saying; "This is stupid! It makes my head hurt! I want to go back to killing dragons!"

And that's not getting into the esoteric stuff from Morrowind along with the deconstructions it does in its main quest. Most modern players hopped up on Fortnite or want fast-paced 'Twitch' gaems would get bored fast and complain about the lack of instant gratification.

 

[Hassknecht]

The problem with Skyrim is that there were really good ideas and lore in the game that wasn't explored upon or felt half finished. Which is a damn shame as I enjoy a heavily modded Skyrim. I get the feeling that Skyrim was rushed during development and/or Zenimax told Bethesda that exploring the lore and world building like in Morrowind would turn casual players off. The Elder Scrolls has very interesting but very weird and far out lore and mythology. Your average 12 year old Fortnite player or Twitch Streamer, if playing a Skyrim that was similar to Morrowind in terms of lore and world building, would have stared dead eyed at the screen saying; "This is stupid! It makes my head hurt! I want to go back to killing dragons!"

I felt Skyrim was still pretty polished, it was heavily streamlined, but it didn't necessarily feel like there was much stuff that was left unfinished. Fallout 4 on the other hand, there I really felt like they just kinda forgot to finish a lot of stuff. Where Skyrim at least had non-randomized quests, Fallout 4 was very, very threadbare there. At least Skyrim didn't have so many locations that were clearly planned to be more fleshed out than they ended up to be. Like, Combat Zone, that robot racing track, Quincy, Libertalia...

 

[TheGM]

I still don't understand why they thought Oblivion of all games needed to be streamlined when making Skyrim, it is not like it was the most complex game ever. Hell, the only really remote RPG aspect I even remember was maybe carrying a Blunt weapon encase you run into the Undead and a custom spell enchanter thingy.

 

[CT Phipps]

I think I realized Fallout 4 had a serious problem when I realized that despite having 4 factions, there's only really 2 Endings.

Kill Institute (Good)
Save Institute (Bad)

Which is weird because the Institute is not noticeably worse than the Brotherhood of Steel. Even the companion dialogue is barely effected.

I still don't understand why they thought Oblivion of all games needed to be streamlined when making Skyrim, it is not like it was the most complex game ever. Hell, the only really remote RPG aspect I even remember was maybe carrying a Blunt weapon encase you run into the Undead and a custom spell enchanter thingy.

Honestly, I feel Skyrim's storytelling is about a hundred times better than Oblivion's. I also feel that the art and world-building is superior too. Certainly, it's better to just have people talk to you and have their opinions adjusted than the weird skill checks to affect their mood.

 

[AgentBJ09]

I still don't understand why they thought Oblivion of all games needed to be streamlined when making Skyrim, it is not like it was the most complex game ever. Hell, the only really remote RPG aspect I even remember was maybe carrying a Blunt weapon encase you run into the Undead and a custom spell enchanter thingy.

The double edged sword of mainstreaming. Bethesda saw people complaining about the percentile skills system in Morrowind and oversimplified that to Oblivion's detriment. Then because Oblivion sold so much better, they got the mistaken impression that more streamlining could only make things better, and Skyrim, sadly, proved them right.

 

[Chud]

Eh, I never liked Skyrim. I found it fun up to about level 25, but then it just became so samey. Tinker with more armor, another quest in a cave with more frost trolls, oh great another dragon. I finished the main quest-line with a good chunk of the side content and then uninstalled it. The leveling system sucked, dragons were weak, and the main factions were blah to me.

I knew Fallout 4 was in trouble when I got my first loading screen, saw the model for a crafting bench and thought, "Oh, no. They made it like Skyrim."

 

[Hassknecht]

I think I realized Fallout 4 had a serious problem when I realized that despite having 4 factions, there's only really 2 Endings.

Kill Institute (Good)
Save Institute (Bad)

Which is weird because the Institute is not noticeably worse than the Brotherhood of Steel. Even the companion dialogue is barely effected.

Worse, you become head of the Institute and could potentially change them for the better, like stopping the whole synth infiltration and kidnapping and shit. And it's not like the Institute has any real plans with the surface world, if they win they want to recede further underground and not really do anything. But you can't really explain that to your companions, who see you as basically Hitler when you side with them.

 

[CT Phipps]

Worse, you become head of the Institute and could potentially change them for the better, like stopping the whole synth infiltration and kidnapping and shit. And it's not like the Institute has any real plans with the surface world, if they win they want to recede further underground and not really do anything. But you can't really explain that to your companions, who see you as basically Hitler when you side with them.

There's a paper Piper prints afterward where she says you're awesome but I don't see why she wouldn't talk to you about it.

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fear_the_Future?

A lot of players missed it because the paper is handwritten and photocopied.

 

[CT Phipps]

I love the Outer Worlds. I gave it a 9 out of 10. However, it does definitely feel AA and could have benefited from a few tweaks here and there. Here's my list of minor complaints and issues I think detracted JUST A BIT from my enjoyment.

1. The endgame is kinda meh: The game runs out of steam roughly around the time of Byzantium. There's some really good quests there but it feels like the game could have done more work there.

2. The game is a bit repetitive: The Outlaws and Marauders are basically Raiders while the same variations of animals are repeated on multiple worlds. It feels like they could have also done a better job with the Final Boss that doesn't feel like an actual boss at all.

3. Some of the factions are samey: There's a kind of theme of "Corporation Assholes vs. Revolutionary Assholes" that runs as a theme. The problem is that it gets repeated multiple times that it would have been nice to have some more variety. I would have liked to have the OSI church explored more outside of max and the Philosophists.

4. The level design is spotty: I remember when I was going to explore Amber Heights and thought it would be a creepy Vault-like level where I read about the downfall of the corporation. Instead, it's literally one room where you find the secret and not even a particularly big room.

5. The Map is Misleading: For the basic gamer, looking at the worlds gives the impression you'll be visiting more worlds than you actually do. Weirdly, this would have been an easy thing to fix as the gas giants could have had the space stations you visit in the game hover above them.

6. The soundtrack: While a bunch of 1950s music would have been too derivative, I do think the lack of a soundtrack is something that was noticeable. I remember FAR CRY: BLOOD DRAGON had an amazing synth score and they could have come up with some kind of Bioshock: Infinite-esque ragtime thing possibly.

7. Length: I got a full 25 hours out of the game by hunting through everything. Still, I think adding a few more adventures through the game would have benefited thing. Ideally, you could have spread this out to be a full 40 like Dragon Age: Origins or other RPGs but I feel like we needed a full third world for this.

8. No SAM Quest: Could have benefited from having one for him.

9. DLC promise: I think the game would benefit from promises of a few DLC to go with this.

10. Kind of PG: I feel like the game could have used the New Vegas brothels or a bit more adult content because it feels a bit G-rated for a story about horrifying political, corporate, and social corruption. Romance companions are a take or a give but it does feel like this is the Saturday Morning Cartoon version of Outer Worlds.

 

[Chud]

I disagree on the music. It's perfectly well-suited background ambiance--it's not meant to be overly bombastic or catchy. It adds rather than distracts from the game.

Sam is a fun companion, mainly for the things it says and how it deals with enemies, but realizing it doesn't have a quest-line felt like such a letdown.

I agree with much of what you say, though I'd rate the overall game a 7.5, but the fun factor is at 9. It really needs some juicy DLC to flesh this world out more. I'm clocking in at around 30 hours, with a possible end time of 35, I think. That's solid to me, much more enjoyable than the endless boredom fest of Fallout 4, which never gave me the level of enjoyment as I've had with The Outer Worlds.

The game feels like a test. Can Obsidian create a new IP with elements cobbled together from ARPGs combined with choice heavy elements of isometric RPGs? I think in this regard Obsidian has succeeded. The hints of other star systems run by different corporations is enticing, especially after finishing one quest that alludes to one being very militaristic in nature. If they bang out some DLC, I've got some great expectations for the sequel. A bigger, more robust The Outer Worlds would be fantastic. Obsidian has always suffered from a lack of funds and time, hopefully Microsoft will give them proper support.

One last note: Seeing as Brian Fargo's inXile is a part of Microsoft, and has said he's open to collaborating with Obsidian in the future, here's hoping that does come to pass.

 

[RangerBoo]

One last note: Seeing as Brian Fargo's inXile is a part of Microsoft, and has said he's open to collaborating with Obsidian in the future, here's hoping that does come to pass.

Holy shit! Bethesda is really going to suffer at the hands of the competition if this happens.

 

[CT Phipps]

Mr. Matty's review of OUTER WORLDS: